Time for a upgrade but have serious thoughts on direction to go. Current setup - Gaggia Baby with Vario grinder.

Daily weekday drinks: 2 Americanos and 1 espresso. And usually double that on weekends.

Last month I thought my choice was a Rocket Hx and just needed to decide between vibratory or rotary pump. (Although I won't be plumbing the machine in.) But now I don't know if this will be the right choice. I work in tech and am starting to think that the antiquated e61 is not the right path forward. I thought I liked the simple nature of a Rocket but maybe I shouldn't shy away from the added tech of PID, shot timers, temp stability.

The new choices I'm considering now are BDB or the forthcoming DE1. Since I seldom make milk drinks I really want to get a machine that gets me the best possible shot. I also wasn't excited about the 45 mins warm up time of an e61.

I guess the dilemma I face is that I always looked forward to the day I would have an e61 on the kitchen counter but think the right choice here is to admit that there are better, cheaper products for my needs. Anyone have similar issue with their upgrade process?

I too was recently shopping for a new machine in your price range, and I decided on the Profitec Pro300. Certainly waiting for a DE1 is an option, but it's unclear when the machines will actually hit the market. The BDB definitely has the tech and ability to make great espresso, but with questionable long-term quality. I decided to pay a little more for higher-quality, Italian construction in the Profitec. The <10min heat-up time and dedicated steam boiler were big selling points for me as well.

Another option may be something like the Quickmill Silvano, which could save you ~$300 compared to the BDB. You'd be set up for great espressos and americanos during the week, and if you decide to make a milk drink on a whim, you've got the dedicated thermoblock and pump to steam while brewing.

If part of you is worried you would regret getting the Rocket...you'll probably regret getting the rocket. I'm sure it can make great drinks, but if you're tech inclined then I think you would probably appreciate some of the new age machines. BDB is great - heats up fast, very temp stable, can turn itself on in the morning - in the looks department you might be sad you're not staring at a pretty e61 in the morning, but once you drink you're espresso you'll be singing a different tune.

DE1 is still a wild card, I'm quite interested in it too, but I don't want to be an early adopter - if you're ready to upgrade it's hard to wait for a machine that isn't even out yet!

More expensive options that I like (not sure what you're budget is):

Profitec Pro 300 (my machine) - heats up quick, nice and shiny, not too expensive! Look up my user experience thread if you're interested.

La Marzocco Linea Mini - Quick heating, pretty, well made, expensive!

Londinium L1 - not a techy machine, but quick heating.

and if you're in love with the e61 aesthetic, there's the Vesuvius - a great blend between high tech and classic looks!

mtnleaf wrote:But now I don't know if this will be the right choice. I work in tech and am starting to think that the antiquated e61 is not the right path forward. I thought I liked the simple nature of a Rocket but maybe I shouldn't shy away from the added tech of PID, shot timers, temp stability.

E61's and PID's aren't mutually exclusive. Nor are E61's and temp stability. Shot timers I'm not sure about but it's up to you to determine how important a shot timer is to you. I'm in tech as well but newer isn't always better. Old tech can be a good option for some things. However, your purchase decision has to be based on what you need and want. If any feature is important to you then get it.

mtnleaf wrote:I also wasn't excited about the 45 mins warm up time of an e61.

If a machine gets its thermal stability via a mass of metal it's going to take time for all the metal to get up to temperature.

You can always use a timer or other device to control power to the machine if you're on a regular schedule. I use a Z-Wave outlet. WeMo is a popular option and there are other solutions out there as well.

mtnleaf wrote:Since I seldom make milk drinks I really want to get a machine that gets me the best possible shot.

I drink milk drinks and I want the best possible shot. Milk doesn't mean that the quality of the espresso doesn't matter. Bad espresso makes a bad milk drink.

If the best possible shot matters, have you put any thought into a grinder?

mtnleaf wrote:I guess the dilemma I face is that I always looked forward to the day I would have an e61 on the kitchen counter but think the right choice here is to admit that there are better, cheaper products for my needs. Anyone have similar issue with their upgrade process?

People have always had this sort of problem with choosing what to buy. You just have to determine your priorities and use them to find the best option for you. Are you really willing to wait on an unreleased and unproven product? Does warm up time matter more than other aspects? How flexible are you with your budget? Or is cheaper more important than other priorities? "Better" is for you to determine. Choosing from any set of decisions is a matter of sorting out where you're willing to compromise and where you're not.

There BDB does offer great performance for the price but I had concerns with it (that may not be justified) and it was a nonstarter for me. YMMV depending on your priorities. If bang for the buck, fast warmup and a built in timer are all priorities for you then the BDB could be a good fit.

Appreciate the comments from everyone so far.

Fausto wrote:Profitec Pro 300 (my machine) - heats up quick, nice and shiny, not too expensive! Look up my user experience thread if you're interested.

Thanks. Didn't know about the Pro 300 before. Your thread has some good info in there to consider.

Sounds like people really like the BDB but perhaps long-term reliability is a question mark. Because I'm familiar with it, I like the appliance-ness factor of the BDB versus a shiny metal machine. Not all that different in the looks category compared to my Gaggia. I've come to hate my stainless steel fridge and all the finger prints and smudge marks. For those with shiny metal machines, do they need anything other than a quick wipe down from time to time?

takeshi wrote:You just have to determine your priorities and use them to find the best option for you.

Good advice. I know quick warm up is more important to me than a machine that's proven to last a decade. I'll have to explore this more and rank my priorities.

Not trying to sway you, but correct your assumption on e61s being too low tech. There are plenty of e61s on PID equipped machines if that's what you are after. Also, E61s are temp stable, have built in preinfusion, are reliable and easy to repair. Warm up time is a non issue with the addition of a Wemo switch or similar device.

Appreciate all the thoughts and perspectives. For my interests and needs at this time I am going to wait a few months and roll the dice with the DE1. The details for what it offers at $999 makes it an overwhelming win for my needs and desires and the chance at being an early adopter of a new tech machine. If it ends up being a disaster I have no problem falling back into a DB or Hx hybrid machine.

I'm in a similar boat, Kris. I have been looking for my first home espresso machine and grinder for a few months. Have looked at everything from the budget-friendly machines up to the GS3; same path on the grinder side.

I agree with you on waiting, if you can. With the DE1 and grind-by-weight Sette coming out "soon", I think we may be at a small technology/features landmark. I am hoping some of these "nice to have" features start showing up on more and more (affordable/non-commercial) hardware soon.

HighlyCaffienated wrote:I agree with you on waiting, if you can. With the DE1 and grind-by-weight Sette coming out "soon", I think we may be at a small technology/features landmark.

Completely agree that we are at the crossroads of new tech machines that are affordable yet packed with advanced features. Luckily, unless my Gaggia breaks, I can wait indefinitely for the DE1.

A new machine is an ''overall'' of features.

Temperature stability from E61 is good, lot of parts if a problem occur etc... I won't stick with the DE1 because I think it's too expansive to bet on a beta tester nightmare or a short term success of a new thing. HX ? Yeah, why not.

BDB is cool to brew and steam at the same time or without waiting time between operations. Batch process will kill you, not your machine. When will you do that ? In my case, the answer is rarely. Do I appreciate my DBD when I use it that way ? For sure. If you are working on a 15A 110v setup (even a 20A 110v...) some machines may lack of power when trying to take advantage of this feature, and it can be frustrating to pay for that and to get poor results. We are talking of situations when the machine is pushed to the limits (and a BDB needs a lot of people to be pushed that way...), but it's something you have to check.

HX in my concern are the best machines for steaming. Incredible power. If cappas and lattes are your main beverages, you will have a lot of fun steaming with that beast. Plenty of power, fast, easy...

Pump: I like the rotary pumps for their reliability concerning a constant and even pressure. Yes, they are very quiet too, but you will wake-up your GF with the grinder anyway. No more rattles, no more cups shaking on top of the warming plate, etc. Look for a setup where the motor is located on top of the pump, not under: if you have a leak at the pump, you will save the motor. Also look for ''on the fly'' pressure adjustment without removing casings.

Plumbing: It's cool to be plumb-in, but if there is a inconsistency in your house water pressure, the pump will suffer from cavitation, and will throw away your rotary pump constant pressure feature. You may install a pressure regulator on the line or whatever, but... And don't forget the pump switch/lever in the ON position if it's plugged on a timer: you will blow your pump if you don't have a low water level sensor or whatever...

A machine is very personnal. Don't let a salesman tell you what you need.

Happy hunting !