Espresso at altitude - Could use some theory

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Martin
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#1: Post by Martin »

For the past 3 years I've lived at 7,500 altitude. Here are some observations (there are many more, but no point in loading up this post :) ) I'd love to get your views and musings that would help me get smarter about what I'm doing.

Water boils here at 197 f or 91 c. Trial, error, and some naive physics leads me to accept shots somewhere between lots-o'- crema, and foamy. Mostly, these shots settle, and result in familiar amounts of crema, though a bit less body, and with finer grind leaning toward ristretto, Few roasts require less than 4 days rest. Vendors blends tend to be flat, and my best blends start with 1:1 medium roast Ethiopian, Central or high, hard bean with a fuller bodied bean like a Sumatra. Best SOs are some Brazil, and a recent Huehuetenego, though these are chancy even when I re-order the same bean, new crop. I'd love a recommendation for an SO, but include why you think it would be a good choice under my circumstances.

BTW, Cafe shots in Santa Fe NM are way not as good as mine. Not what I experienced in LA and NYC.

Thoughts?
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cannonfodder
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#2: Post by cannonfodder »

High Altitude Brewing
Espresso machines for high altitude
How does elevation affect espresso - or do you think it does?
Levers at higher altitudes
How does high altitude affect brewing?

That should get you a a couple hours of browsing. There are more threads than that on the 'Denver effect' and coffee.
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Martin (original poster)
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#3: Post by Martin (original poster) »

Thank you. I read a bunch of these 3-4 years ago but having them "collected" here, along with some new ones, is very helpful for review of espresso generally as well as my specific question. Probably my error in thinking I've missed some grand theory: no hidden secrets to espresso at 7500 feet, any more than at "Denver" (5200); NYC (65ft) or someone who posted at over 9k. It's all a secret, unraveled to taste.
Heat + Beans = Roast. All the rest is commentary.

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keno
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#4: Post by keno »

Depends upon the altitude. If you're talking really high elevations, like zero gravity in space then NASA has some research. :lol:

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F1
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#5: Post by F1 »

I live at 6,000' south of Denver. Local roasters like Boxcar Coffee and Novo don't pull any shots with their beans any sooner than 7 days post roast. The baristas at both roasters have told me to wait at least 14 to 17 days to get the absolute best flavor out of their roasts. They say the cause is due to the altitude and the dry weather. I didn't really believe it at the beginning, but they were 100% right. Even beans that are roasted close to sea level like Counter Culture Coffee I have to wait a minimum of 7 days. If I try to pull any shots before that all I get is a really thick cone of Crema coming out of the portafilter. The cone collapses really fast and then blonds around 15 secs into the extraction. I get a lot of CREMA in the cup, but it disappears within a few seconds. The flavor is like eating a cigar and no body. This is the case with light, medium, dark roasts.

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#6: Post by EspressoForge »

F1 wrote:The flavor is like eating a cigar and no body.
I got a great laugh from that, thanks!

Sorry I can't contribute to the high-altitude espresso, but makes me think I should take my machine hiking and find out!

OldNuc
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#7: Post by OldNuc »

Average elevation of Italy is listed as 1,667 ft and that includes Monte Bianco at 15,777 ft which really should not enter into the inhabited average elevation. As the Italians developed espresso and they do not experience 5000+ Ft inhabited elevations to a great extent the affect of high altitude was never considered. You are your own in this high altitude espresso area.

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homeburrero
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#8: Post by homeburrero »

F1 wrote:The baristas at both roasters have told me to wait at least 14 to 17 days to get the absolute best flavor out of their roasts.
Nice tip! I've read similar in an old coffeed.com post by a roaster/barista at Coal Creek in Laramie who recommended resting in unsealed bins for two weeks. (Coal creek is worth a stop if you get up to Laramie.)

And Alejandro Mendez, who won the 2011 WBC in Bogota at 8600 ft, said in his presentation:
... I tested different roast dates at high altitude in El Salvador to see how they reacted under similar conditions to those here in Bogota. And it was at exactly 14 days that I got the best result.
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F1
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#9: Post by F1 replying to homeburrero »

That coffeed.com link is a great read. I wish I had found it years ago when I bought my first espresso machine. It would have saved me a lot of beans. :lol:

While I have waited 2 weeks to use many espresso beans I have always done it in a sealed package. I'll sacrifice my next espresso beans and leave them exposed to air and see how they taste after two weeks.

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Martin (original poster)
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#10: Post by Martin (original poster) »

F1 wrote:I live at 6,000' south of Denver. Local roasters like Boxcar Coffee and Novo don't pull any shots with their beans any sooner than 7 days post roast. .
Longer rests are definitely helpful. This is not a subtle call. But why? What's going on chemically (physical difference is visually apparent) when the more volitile (?) retained gas is released in with a shprter- or longer rest? Other matters of note: Roasting times are around 15% longer for same degree of roast. Overall, darker roasts are more fully developed and complex while lighter roasts are more difficult to hit with precision. This has been the greatest challenge after having trained my palate (at low altitude) to appreciate brighter espressos.

How would you expect an optimal roast/rest at lower altitude to compare with an optimal roast/rest at much higher altitude? My assumption is that shots would not be quite as good, and there's little to be gained even after making all reasonable corrections as one moves up. (Not something I'm prepared to test empirically by traveling several zip codes away) :)
Heat + Beans = Roast. All the rest is commentary.

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