Article: "Why Espressos in America are not Good?" - Page 3

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LukeFlynn
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#21: Post by LukeFlynn »

yakster wrote:At these prices, it's no surprise that cafes rely on the free machines from their coffee wholesaler and don't persue higher end machines.
+1

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Randy G.
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#22: Post by Randy G. »

I read through enough of that article until I was about to develop nausea. All I could think of when I closed the page was the fable about monkeys at typewriters, modified for this situation. "If three monkeys at two typewriters with a years supply of single malt spent a week, they would be able to write a better article about the state of espresso in America."
EspressoMyEspresso.com - 2000-2023 - a good run, its time is done

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peacecup
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#23: Post by peacecup »

I have had tons of poor espresso in the US. Now, when I am familiar with a city, I will only frequent shops where I KNOW there is good espresso. But on a random stop at an independent shop in the Midwest, the odds are that you are not going to be served a quality espresso.

To that degree, there is certainly some truth within the article.
I agree with this - and extend it beyond any geographical boundary (midwest). Yes, the article sounds funny in ways, but there is a bit of truth there. I buy Italian espresso beans almost exclusively, and pull shots on simple second-hand lever machines ground with small-burr conical hand grinders. I won't win any competitions with my espresso, but it's damn good.

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Nick Name
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#24: Post by Nick Name »

From a Scandinavian viewpoint:

I've never had a really good cup of coffee in US. But I've never had one in Italy either.

I've never searched for one in US, but in Italy I have.
Not to say that they're easy to find in Scandinavia. A good cup of coffee is a rarity.

BTW, all the beans he mentions in the article are crap and are sold stale.

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peacecup
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#25: Post by peacecup »

I'd thought about bringing up the Scandinavian style, but dropped it. I either don't like or can't figure out how to pull good shots with the light roasts I get here. And since most of the cafes have no clue (as everywhere) one typically gets bad light-roast espresso. But even in good cafes in Oslo I don't particularly like light roast espresso.

I guess it comes down to too many factors to just say good or bad. I like Italian-style espresso, and when I make it it is really good. What I've had in Italy varied but it was almost never bad. Of it was I just tossed in the sugar and enjoyed it anyway.

In the US and here in Sweden I got a lot of bad espresso at cafes because I don't like that style as much, and when its bad it's really bad - sugar doesn't help with light-roasted espresso. By contrast someone who likes third-wave espresso would find most Italian cafe espresso bad. - but then they need to find really good cafes anyway.
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Marcelnl
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#26: Post by Marcelnl »

To me it seems that regional tastes differ, Italians are notorious for their love of sweet stuf, just look at how much sugar they typically spoon in a tiny espresso, scandinavians like salt and acid a lot whereas central Europe has a bit more balanced palate. I think that these influences are important ones to consider when judging espresso styles. Personally I also do not like the light roasts, one of the reasons to start roasting myself is that my faemina has a hard time coping w the lighter roasts where it truly shines with everything a bit further beyond FC and I happen to like that taste a lot! (Bought a grinder to match)

In the city I now live in I've yet to find one place where I truly like the espresso, regardless of whatever shiny and expensive machines they have. Coming to the price, I am happy to pay a euro or two for a decent double knowing that the software (coffee) will lie around 50ct a double, but if I get a watery dilution of battery acid I don't come back. some of the places in town have a KvdW, a decent grinder but nobody knowing to operate it well enough and probably no fresh roasted beans either, judging by the taste...in Italy you pay a euro, if it's good life is good, if not you try your luck someplace else, spotting a good chance of a decent cup is easy in Italy..just compare the nr of customers in a few shops and follow the crowd :-)
I just don't believe that you need a high end machine to produce decent to good espresso that will end up costing a lot more than the cost and amount of coffee would justify, invest in training staff properly, get a decent machine a great grinder, a good bean supply and put out good to great espresso, depending on the form of the day.
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RioCruz
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#27: Post by RioCruz »

peacecup wrote: In the US and here in Sweden I got a lot of bad espresso at cafes because I don't like that style as much, and when its bad it's really bad - sugar doesn't help with light-roasted espresso.
This is why the gods created half and half! :)
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Marcelnl
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#28: Post by Marcelnl replying to RioCruz »

Does that work for you with light roasts? i find that the acidity is masked to some extent but that the atsringency many of these roasts posess is not.
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sarends
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#29: Post by sarends »

Maybe we need this:

"Derek Zoolander's school for American barista's who can't make espresso good"

41fivestar
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#30: Post by 41fivestar »

SonVolt wrote:Interesting about La Marzocco being marketed as a high-end Italian machine that's not well known in Italy. Is that true?
Yup. LM used to be the USBC/WBC machine sponsor and took over the US market. La Cimbali, San Marco, and others are much more popular in Europe than LM.

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