Graham J wrote:The UK Lelit distributor, Bella Barista, retained DaveC (Dave Corby, who did some test work for Lelit on the prototype machines) to write a very useful 26 page Userguide, which sits alongside Lelits own handbook and adds more detail, including eight useful shot profiles in detail. These have supporting videos of the profiles in use.

Is it possible to purchase Dave Corby's manual? I'm a new US owner who purchased my machine from 1st-line.

So far, only three days, I'm very impressed. This is clearly a well made machine and relatively easy to use. That's saying a lot given this is my first espresso machine.

Thanks - Rick

open_market wrote:Is it possible to purchase Dave Corby's manual? I'm a new US owner who purchased my machine from 1st-line.

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Rick, this guide by DaveC seems to be property of Bella Barista here in U.K. So as Bianca owners we aren't at liberty to republish or provide links to the accompanying videos. It would be good if First-Line procured it for you!
Having said that, DaveC has already provided some Bianca advice on this thread and elsewhere. There's some good links on YouTube including the Lelit videos.
I've used quite a few of DaveC's eight Bianca profiles and I can provide my experience of those. Also the main Bianca review on HB will provide versions of these and other ideas. So, we'll get good information shared!

looks damn hot

Jim's Varying brew temp with shot length:

I hope other owner experiment along these lines and improve on these tips. Please post in the user experience thread; and we'll update the bench review as the information comes in. I am not aware of anyone experimenting along these lines with previous E61 profiling machines, although I may have missed it.

Back in my earlier post in this thread, on initial (first 200 shots) experience with Bianca, I noted that I found it better (meaning more predictable rather than specific taste variables) to run with a temperature setting about 4C above that recommended by my Roaster (Forge Coffee Roasters in Sheffield U.K.) for a given roast. This roaster runs an LM Linea for espresso extraction notes given to customers. I had just assumed LM runs hotter at the PF, with its saturated group design, than the Bianca's E61, for the same temp readout.

A key Bianca point that I didn't recognise, was that this works for the profiling shots I mostly run, but not so for the conventional 25-30 second shots, where the water temp is not so affected by the slightly cooler group temp. This is useful intelligence, thank you, another_jim!
I'll now experiment with temp adjustment. Coming down from slightly higher is no problem, just a couple of button pushes and cooling will take effect whilst grinding. Going the other way, from lower temp to higher, as noted, a short lever operation to initiate the boiler heating, will likely be needed.

I'll mention that on the YouTube videos by Lelit, showing Bianca profiling shots, they always start with a flush. Their flush is short, but results in quite a bit of steam. When I pre-flush my Bianca, I find that it takes a little longer (3 seconds, before steam emerges with water, so I use two short sequential pre-flushes of about 3-5 seconds, looking for steam as well - no logic base to the double flush!

The factor setting is a 10C difference between the boiler and the displayed temperature. This works for Dan, who is also reviewing the machine, and it worked for DaveC. However, my thermosyphon keeps the group a few degrees cooler than theirs. It sounds like you machine is more like mine than theirs in this regard. I initially cranked up the panel setting; now I've changed the offset on mine by three C, so the display reads 13C below the actual brew boiler temperature. I also goosed some of my PID settings to get a quicker heating response during the shots; this comes at the price of more overshoots during the idle.

I'll give instructions on changing the factory settings once it's cleared with Lelit, or I get tired of waiting. There is a reset parameter that will restore factor settings if you get it wrong. And making changes will require familiarity with your particular machine.

Graham J wrote:I've used quite a few of DaveC's eight Bianca profiles and I can provide my experience of those. Also the main Bianca review on HB will provide versions of these and other ideas. So, we'll get good information shared!

Thanks Graham

another_jim wrote:The factor setting is a 10C difference between the boiler and the displayed temperature. This works for Dan, who is also reviewing the machine, and it worked for DaveC. However, my thermosyphon keeps the group a few degrees cooler than theirs. It sounds like you machine is more like mine than theirs in this regard. I initially cranked up the panel setting; now I've changed the offset on mine by three C, so the display reads 13C below the actual brew boiler temperature. I also goosed some of my PID settings to get a quicker heating response during the shots; this comes at the price of more overshoots during the idle.

I'll give instructions on changing the factory settings once it's cleared with Lelit, or I get tired of waiting. There is a reset parameter that will restore factor settings if you get it wrong. And making changes will require familiarity with your particular machine.

Interesting to see how this develops with other users also. It seems that I need to make some temperature measurements....

The procedure for adjusting P, I & D for the heating elements, offset etc, is already published to Bianca users in UK, who have purchased from Bella Barista, via their user guide.Also for returning to original firmware settings. So it should be ok to share this when you are ready (or tired of waiting).

I've already followed a DaveC prompt to tweak the Kpc value downwards for UK users (240V nominal)., but this could cause the machine to take longer to return to set point at U.S. voltage. It needs water measurement to know if this could influence water temp on a longer profiling shot.

As you make the point, probably best to know your own machines temperature offset, especially if it turns out that there is some significant machine to machine variation. For this reason I'm contemplating a Scace thermofilter, or cheaper options.

Since the flow rate is variable, a thermofilter is not required, you can just sling a TC into an old basket and use the paddle to get the flow rates you want.

However, after doing the thermometry; I would say the simplest way to adjust the offset is to measure the group at the neck. Use a sticky pad to glue on a naked TC. It will read at the initial shot temperature (once the basket with the TC fills) and the temperatture will climb 1C to 2.5C, depending on flow rate and shot length over, the course of the shot. The group is so heavy that it determines shot temperature. Adjust you offset accordingly.

We are posting the PID setting manual. The link and details will be up by end of day.

I want to emphasize that adjusting the offset between brew boiler and the indicated temperature, so that the indicated temperature accurately reflects the shot temperature, is a thing with every double machine, whether the group is thermosyphoned (E61s, La Spaziale)), saturated (LMs), or integrated into the brew boiler (Dalla Corte and Linea Mini). I know lots of owners of every kind of double boiler machine who have changed that offset.

So why doesn't the factory get it right in every case? My guess is that there is something thermally chaotic going on, that amplifies small manufacturing differences into larger temperature differences. In a saturated or thermosyphon group, you are dealing with very slow flows induced by thermal gradients. Perhaps this amplifies small manufacturing differences.