Astoria Perla Water Leak from Safety Valve

Equipment doesn't work? Troubleshooting? If you're handy, members can help.
Smokey
Posts: 23
Joined: 6 years ago

#1: Post by Smokey »

Hi All,
First time here on the forum. Been reading a lot, but never needed help until now.

Just acquired a 2010ish Astoria Perla AEP single head.
It was in regular use at a restaurant, they upgraded, I took the old one off their hands for a good price.

After taking it apart, and monitoring the internals while it heated up, i noticed that the safety valve and the anti-vacuum valve both leak water. A significant amount of water.

Is a simple swap of the safety valve a good first step?
What other areas could contribute to heavy leaks from the safety valve?


Smokey (original poster)
Posts: 23
Joined: 6 years ago

#2: Post by Smokey (original poster) »

Checked the boiler water level Probe, just to see if it was scaled over. Looks brand new.
Is it possible that the water pressure from the water source is simply too high? I closed the tap and just let a portion of the water come through, and the safety valve still leaks, but doesn't spray water like before.

The machine was in "working order" before transporting it. I visually inspected it and there were no leaks when it was in use. Strange that the leaks are coming up when I hook it up to a. Water source.

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MNate
Posts: 957
Joined: 8 years ago

#3: Post by MNate »

Oo- that's the machine I have! Except mine wasn't working when I got it. I think it's pretty nice and easy to work on. Though there were a lot of things I didn't understand (and still don't) upon taking it apart...

Here's my thread but I never really finished giving my results:
Astoria overfill [solved]

This one is similar too:
Astoria Argenta SAE-1J

I did replace my vacuum breaker valve since it was not operating very smoothly and was only about $10 on espressoparts.com (figuring out which parts diagram to use was tough and actually now I don't see the one I concluded I would use on it... hmm...).

The vacuum breaker should let out air as the boiler is coming up to pressure, maybe a little water spitting out. Does it ever get to pressure and close?

It's nice to order a bunch of parts at once when you do, notably the rubber washers that you probably want to replace as you put things back together. I can try to do a little more looking and say better what I did, anyway.

I'd love to hear more about things as you get them going to see what you find works well with it. It's been pretty nice to use this last year!

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MNate
Posts: 957
Joined: 8 years ago

#4: Post by MNate »

Oh, it was cafeparts.com that had the better parts list for me.

I replaced part 19 and 11 on here: (anti-depression valve). Oh, and #16... haha...
http://www.cafeparts.com/productDetail5 ... 7&ItemID=0

The "Perla" one wasn't usually the right idea. "Boiler with extractable exchanger". Just match the pictures to your machine and it should get you there!

Smokey (original poster)
Posts: 23
Joined: 6 years ago

#5: Post by Smokey (original poster) »

Thanks for the direction.

I've been reading over both of those threads, but somehow nothing seems to be exactly the same, and therefore increases the intimidation in taking things apart. Gotta start somewhere though.

The boiler builds up pressure. Just turned it on now, and the vacuum valve is still hissing as pressure builds up.
The group head pressure is steady at 7 bar.
Still waiting on the steam pressure to build up.

Pressure seems to hold, the machine warms nicely and all seems to be in working order except the occasional heavy leak on the safety valve.
Need to spend a bit of time with IDing when and under what circumstances the safety valve leaks. Will update as things occur.

Smokey (original poster)
Posts: 23
Joined: 6 years ago

#6: Post by Smokey (original poster) »

Here was the series of events.

Plug in machine
Connect water source
Turn machine on (Nr. 2,not Nr. 1)
Waited approximately 20-25 min, and steam pressure got to 1 bar.
Group head pressure steady at 7 bar.
Vacuum vale still hissing up until this point.
Pump hasn't activated at all. I haven't engaged the group head or the steam wand yet.
Just recognized a slow leak coming from a drain pipe, connected into the group head, behind where the portafilter goes. It is leaking directly into the drain cup, so nothing alarming, but it doesn't seem right that it's a consistent drip.


10 min later, the vacuum valve is still hissing and seems like is doesn't want to seal. It actually looks like it's been replaced recently, so I didn't expect any issues from it. Are there other reasons why hissing would still come from the vacuum valve? Possible that the water temperature is too low and not creating enough pressure for a seal?

Smokey (original poster)
Posts: 23
Joined: 6 years ago

#7: Post by Smokey (original poster) »

Another quick update.

Since the last post the anti-vacuum valve is still hissing. No water coming out, not wet steam, just dry steam.

No leaks from the safety valve as of yet.

After engaging the wand and group head, all seems to be in order.

A few backflushes also didn't bring up any new problems (leaks, noises etc.)

A couple of test shots did bring up a new clicking noise when the pump starts up. Instead of the tight small noises that the pump normally makes, instead I hear a lower pitched, longer duration click, in sync with the pump action itself. No ideas of what this could be.

Since the safety valve isn't leaking (anymore), the only logical conclusion I can make is that the electric contact on the boiler water level probe wasn't set properly. I removed it yesterday to check the probe for scale, and it seems upon replacing it, the safety valve issue no longer is. Water was shooting out of the safety valve, because there wasn't a connected water level probe before.






Smokey (original poster)
Posts: 23
Joined: 6 years ago

#8: Post by Smokey (original poster) »

A couple of new issues popping up. Maybe someone can offer some advice.

1) There is a constant hissing while the machine is on. It is coming from the safety valve. Since it's pretty old, I'm going to go down the full replacement route. Good idea?
2) There is a constant leak from the outlet pipe. This feels off. What should I be considering to locate the drip?
3) I can't achieve any pressure through the group head unless the machine is connected to a fixed water source. While connected, I can only ever hit 6 bar, and when activating the group head, the pressure gauge doesn't change. The only time the pressure gauge moves is when steam pressure is being built up for the steam wand, or when I open the valve of the water source, and let the water pressure enter the machine. Shouldn't the machine itself be able to generate 7-9 bar without the help of a fixed water source?

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MNate
Posts: 957
Joined: 8 years ago

#9: Post by MNate »

Yes, I'd just replace the whole anti-vacuum valve. The brass ring there doesn't seem to seal well when removed once and this is one thing that's pretty easy just to get new.

And where do you see the drip? Out the actual black drain cup? Is it coming from that rubber hose that comes down from your hissing anti-vac valve? That's what I'd expect but could be other things.

Here's what I'd do:
1. Determine that the problems aren't too major, this thing will work. Therefore...
2. Take lots of pictures of everything from every angle...
3. Take off and soak anything you can in some sort of Citric acid or whatever you see people recommend on here for cleaning pipes. Mushroom cap, three-way solenoids, etc.
4. Order a new anti-vac and any little rubber piece you can find online to order for it. I think you can easily take off most of the "lower hydraulics" and you'll find lots of rubber washers and screens that are very clogged with gunk. Just replace everything cheap. Order a new brew head gasket (what's the official name for that rubber piece above the portafilter?). Maybe even two of many of these. And get some food safe grease too (see recommendations on H-B).
5. Maybe even open up the boiler and do some cleaning in there. It's not too difficult.
6. Get your water line ready. You'll definitely want one.
7. Put everything back together and see if it works! It really might!

The key is to find the right diagram on a parts site, and take enough pictures of your stuff that you can get it back together. Yours doesn't have the volumetric stuff so yours won't be exactly like the diagram but close enough.

Good luck!

Smokey (original poster)
Posts: 23
Joined: 6 years ago

#10: Post by Smokey (original poster) »

Thanks for the feedback.
Holidays got in the way of my reply.

During the holidays, the safety valve decided to have a random heavy leak, while the machine was on and functioning normally, or so I thought.

It's been off since, and I've ordered a new safety valve with some extra gaskets and o-rings. I'll swap it out and see if anything changes.

Regarding that constant leak, it is coming from #7 (http://www.cafeparts.com/Espresso-Machi ... -Group-Cts)
I've gone ahead and ordered some o-rings for that area too, to see if that's the issue. While disassembling, I'm sure I will encounter some new issues.

Got the citric acid ready, and the camera is ready to go. Will keep updated here, as to help anyone else along the way.

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