nice, I do disagree with some parts, but I don't have the time right now. I'll be back later to explain but thanks for your input, much appreciated.

[creative nickname] wrote: and rarely push a coffee in a .... direction beyond what it already had to offer. .

I have come to think that the most important skill in coffee roasting is buying the right beans.

This. Yes!

You can't roast bad coffee to good. You can roast good coffee to bad. You can roast bad coffee DARK though.

To lengthen maillard I'd keep the temperature the same but allow more time to FC by making the ramp more gentle... Can your machine do this? Just add 30s or so to begin with perhaps.
I'm not sure how I'd obtain flavours from a coffee if they're not present in it in the first place...

Lately, I've been stretching my roasts from 280* to 340*F, (<20* RoR) then adding heat to push them through an aggressive 1C. I reduce the heat just prior to 1C and let RoR coast to 10* for the remainder, lowering heat a little at a time to keep RoR from creeping up as the coffee tries to exotherm. On my darker roasts, that coast 10-15 seconds into 2C, I keep RoR a bit higher to reach drop temp before 25% development. The results have been quite favorable with chocolate coffees, Brazil, Colombia, Sumatra and even Centrals. I'm getting a nice buttery nose from the cooling bin.

I'm roasting the raja batak as well (picked it up on the shrub side of SM/Shrub) and I just don't think there's much chocolate to it. there's plenty of deeper flavors, molasses and cola, but not much chocolate. I think a java would be easier to coax chocolate out of, or my personal favorite is a nice oaxaca.

In my opinion, you can't get a specific flavor note out of a coffee if it's not in a coffee. Of course, you can get classes of flavor, or adjust the attributes fairly easily. In other words, all coffees can develop caramel tones from caramelization. You can promote the acidity of any coffee by roasting faster through the maillards, or promote maillard flavors by slowing that phase. But if a coffee lacks a particular note due to lacking particular compounds, it's pretty tough to compensate and then increase that flavor note. It's just not gonna be there. If it's lacking the flavor note due to the way you roasted, just roast differently. But sometimes you gotta admit defeat, and I would say that this Raja Batak is not chocolatey.

guys, guys. I guess I should not have listed the bean.... what I asked was how do you maximize the chocolate in a bean. Not if you believe ...or you opinion of what I can achieve, again not to be hyperbolic nor discredit your posts. But the question is how do you maximize the flavor of chocolate. I kindly ask you to answer the question and I do not mind hearing the believes or opinions you hold, but few have actually given answers, we can talk about what your favorite sauce for fries are but I still want to hear how you maximize chocolate no matter the bean, if you do something different for one origin or another that is friggin gold to my ears. But I don't want to hear is "oh your using that, that's impossible." Because first I don't believe you and second, watch me do it baby!

To go on a tangent: Have you not taken in consideration that maybe chocolate is made up of a conglomerate of chemicals/compounds that come together to make what you are familiar with the word chocolate? I have some cocao nibs that when brewed taste like grape jam with a very water like mouthfeel and extremely dry aftertaste. This raja batak is not soy sauc-ey, but hey, I did a roast and pulled an espresso and got full on double fermented soy sauce complete with salt and instead of dumping it, it became the base for my teriyaki sauce. Maybe I am asking you to see beyond your conventional wisdom and look beyond the beyond. It seems like it not me who is kidding themselves...

aecletec wrote:To lengthen maillard I'd keep the temperature the same but allow more time to FC by making the ramp more gentle... Can your machine do this? Just add 30s or so to begin with perhaps.
I'm not sure how I'd obtain flavours from a coffee if they're not present in it in the first place...

By "keep the temp the same" I am assuming you mean the end temp of the phase, and yes I can do this, gracias.

@Almico thanks, that is what im talk'n bout. I could kiss you. 17 more roasts left with his bean, I'll see how it goes.

crunchybean wrote:By"keep the temp the same" I am assuming you mean the end temp of the phase, and yes I can do this, gracias.

Sorry yes! I've done this on a few coffees even before reading Hoos and find it works well for me. All the best!
I think Almico and I are describing similar things?

Several years ago when I first learned to operate my commercial sample roaster, I happened to have a batch full of sickening chocolate note in it. It was SM Espresso Workshop #30, a blend of Rwanda, Guatemala, and El Salvador.



As can be seen in my roast graph, it had extremely long (6:12) Maillard phase. I played with the Airflow settings of my roaster at the time, because I wanted to observe the effect of Airflow on the BT RoR during the roast. Therefore, I had variable Airflow during the MAI as well as the Finishing phase. I didn't label my Airflow setting on my graph, but the Airflow was much higher than my current setting. There was no momentum prior to the First Crack Start. After the First Crack Starts, the Finishing phase continued for 3:50. The bean was dropped at relatively low temperature (FCs + 23.6*F; 398.3*F).


Now coming back to your question, how to emphasize chocolate note. My straight answer is to try a different origin of bean. What's not in the bean to begin with cannot be emphasized. However, if you are so determined, you can roast to kill off all of the other flavors. Extremely long Maillard reaction to remove simple sugar sweetness; long Finishing phase to eliminate acidity; high airflow to pull volatile aromas off; and low drop temperature to prevent pyrolysis.

9Sbeans wrote: SM Espresso Workshop #30, a blend of Rwanda, Guatemala, and El Salvador.

aka Harmonic Tremor. I completely overlooked that one. Great name!