Sounds like it's time to take a deep breath, step back, and think.... Good advice at this point would be to get another barista to drop by with their grinder and their own coffee to see if it makes a difference. If I lived closer i would be glad to do it... I would fly down but they would charge me a lot to check my Kony as baggage..

A Scace device to double check the brew pressure would be nice, but it is an expensive tool. This would verify the correct function of the OPV. It would also verify the accuracy of the onboard pressure gauge.

Have you opened the OPV by removing the adjustment screw?
Go here:
Buyer's Guide to the Vibiemme Domobar Super
Among lots of useful information, down the page there is a photo of the correct spring next to the wrong one. It is easy to access and remove (relatively speaking). Opening the OPV will make sure there is no crud in there which may affect the operation of the valve.

Mild success? I finally got to 5 BAR with a double shot after aggressive WDT, 0 point grind, fresh coffee.
Sorry for the bad camera, I'm going to get a high res one this weekend.

Here is the cup right after the shot:


The spent puck (notice the cracks which leads to fast pours?):


The shot after sitting for two or three minutes:


After looking at the images more closely from the WDT, it still seems that my grind is still too coarse?:
/weiss-dist ... age019.jpg

My tamped puck doesn't look nearly as clean as:
/weiss-dist ... age031.jpg

Do these images help at all?

Thanks a lot all.

I looked at the two sample linked pics. The grind looks close enough that you should not be having such extreme problems. On the other hand, I would ask, looking at the second linked pic, have you done the lock and remove test? That pic looks like it may have just a bit too much coffee in it- at least to say, I have been leaving a bit more headroom with excellent results. The Rocky creates a relatively dense grind (relative to my Kony which produces a fluffier grind). Swiping some coffee off the top before tamping, as I have mentioned, might be a good thing.

Mason -

Is your Vibiemme still under a warranty? If so, I would be on the phone with my retailer first thing Monday morning after I sent an e-mail their way referencing this thread.

Have you disassembled the OPV and compared the spring styles as Randy recommended a few posts up from this one? Your pressures are all over the place and this would be a very likely cause.

Hi all,

Yea I just bought the VBM a week ago from 1st-line. I've been in email contact with Jim about it too. I had to go to my parents place this weekend, so I haven't been able to checkout the OPV. Do you know if they are still shipping with the old springs? Randy's post was from 2007, so maybe Jim has already been replacing them?

One interesting thing is, I took Marshalls and other's advice. I made my way down to the cafe, and talked with the baristas there. I brought some of my rocky grinds down to the shop and compared the rocky grind to theirs. The cafe's is MUCH finer. I bought a pound of their coffee pre-ground from their grinder. Anyone know if one day old pre-ground is going to affect the shot that much? I'm sure in terms of taste it will, but at least in pull time? Does a commercial machine need a lot finer grind than a home VBM?

I also spent some time pulling shots, tamping, and watching the Baristas do their magic. One of the more interesting things I saw was with a commercial machine, espresso started to pour within a second or two of starting the extraction. This was also the case with how to dial in a new espresso machine:
Dialing in a new espresso machine, a step by step guide

Other machines in videos of espresso extraction take a few seconds:
Videos of espresso extractions

Is the time it takes from switching on the brew to first pour a function of the grind/espresso or is it a machine specific thing?

As for the sourness of my shots, I think it is because of my technique. Using the cafe's espresso, I tried tamping and got a sour shot.

Either way, I'm going to try the pre-ground shots tomorrow and see if I can at least get some pressure. If so, I think I'm going to have to plunker down for a new grinder. Is the mazzer mini capable enough for a VBM?
http://www.1st-line.com/machines/home_m ... iblack.htm

Or the Macaps?
http://www.1st-line.com/machines/home_m ... /M4C18.htm

I also got a high resolution camera, so I'll post pics tomorrow of my rocky grind.

BTW the cafe i went to was Jones' Coffee (http://jonescoffeecompany.com/). Gotta plug them for being so nice. Their JC Espresso roast is a sweet coffee.

Again thanks everyone for the help.

Hmm Interesting. I just read this on 1st-line (http://www.1st-line.com/machines/home_m ... /rocky.htm):

Please note as with all coffee grinders, it is very important to only change grind settings on Rocky coffee grinders when the unit is powered 'on' and the burrs are in motion. If you do not do this, the burrs will 'gunk' up and require cleaning by you every time this occurs. Changing the grind settings when the burrs are not in motion will render the grinder to only produce very coarse grinds or no grinds at all. If this result occurs, this will be considered operator error for lack of following directions, and will not be classified as a defective grinder - meaning this is not covered under warranty.

However, reading the actual rocky manual:

With the motor off and the bean container empty,
press adjustment button (4) and turn the container (1) in a clockwise direction until the grinders
touch; filter.

Can anyone confirm which is the correct process? If the fact is that you had to change the grinder with the burrs in motion, I can see why I couldn't produce any real espresso. I always changed the grinder with the burrs off.

For a MACAP or Mini, do you have to be running the burrs to change the espresso grind?

Thanks

mlc85 wrote: Is the mazzer mini capable enough for a VBM?

Oh yes - it's a mid-budget match made in heaven, IMO!

BTW, it looks like (to me at least) that the main and maybe only issue is the grind being too coarse in your case, nothing wrong with the VBM. For a test, ask at your local cafe to grind you some beans into a small container/paper cup which you can take home to pull another test shot. Let us know then at what brew pressure is your Vibi sitting on after the first 6-7 secs of preinfusion.

cheers!

mlc85 wrote:Can anyone confirm which is the correct process? If the fact is that you had to change the grinder with the burrs in motion, I can see why I couldn't produce any real espresso. I always changed the grinder with the burrs off. For a MACAP or Mini, do you have to be running the burrs to change the espresso grind?

If the chamber is filled with ground coffee, moving the grind setting finer can result in the burrs binding and stalling the motor. In practice, I only move the setting a millimeter or two finer, so whether the motor is running or not hasn't been an issue. Obviously going from French press to espresso grind setting without emptying the grind chamber or running the motor is asking for trouble.

My assumption is that 1st-line's warning is to (a) avoid binding, and (b) to prevent the burrs becoming fouled with coffee tar. I've only seen it happen once with a brand new Macap grinder, i.e., the burrs were coated with a dark, hard brown gunk that rendered the grinder inoperable. Cleaning the burrs with a pointy implement returned the grinder to working order and the problem never reoccurred.

If can't hurt to clean the grinder. Mark wrote a good article on your grinder, How to Clean a Rancilio Rocky. You may also want to read How to find the Rocky true zero point.

I would have to assume that the OPV spring is the correct one and that the grinder is the culprit.

The Mazzer Mini is a good grinder, but I would recommend the Jolly over it. Used Jolly grinders pop up on eBay and can be a great deal. Add new burrs and you are set. The Jolly is popular in coffee shops because they are made for heavy duty use and made to last a long time. They are easy to sell, but once you use one you will never let it go.

I am really really really lost now. I brought back the fine ground coffee and only managed to get 6 BAR. I also took a look at the OPV, but couldn't find a spring anywhere. All I see is the screw to change it beneath the water reservoir.

Is there something incredibly obvious I'm missing here? Even with the finer ground coffee, I'm getting a 15 second or so shot. I took pictures of the whole process using the cafe grounds.

Here is the grinds my rocky spits out at 2-3 notches from 0 point:


Here is the ground stuff from the cafe I brought home yesterday:


Here is the leveled puck:


Tamped puck:


And finally the spent puck:


I'm really lost as to what to do at all now. Is espresso supposed to be THIS much finer? The cafe grounds were directly from their SJ that they used on their commercial machines. What is going on??

On a good note, I finally got micro foam and can do latte art again.