Speedster Questions

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klosor5
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#1: Post by klosor5 »

I'm making this thread since the legendary machine only really has one thread and it died out for some reason. Most people seem seriously disinformed in regards to the shot profiling it does (Claiming it only can do a flat 9-bar shot for instance, even though the Idromatic extension makes this the most versatile high-end machine behind the Decent and GS3 MP, although its stepped design makes it way more consistent than the GS3).

Anyways, can someone explain to me the group head design that this fine machine uses? My understanding is that it's a version of the E61, but I also read somewhere that the Spirit uses a Saturated grouphead design, but since Saturated grouphead designs produce better quality shots, it would make sense to me that the Speedster also has this.

How is temperature stability achieved and how is it different to other machines? Kees seemed keen on head exchangers (thermal syphoning) in order to achieve some of that stability in an interview but I didn't really get much more detail out of it.

I also read that the Speedster doesn't require any flushing before shotpulling, but I can't confirm anything with so little information and I haven't gotten a response when I last sent an e-mail.

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JohnB.
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#2: Post by JohnB. »

Reading through the Construction page on Kees site should answer most of your questions. https://keesvanderwesten.com/speedster/construction

The Speedster uses a saturated group.
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klosor5 (original poster)
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#3: Post by klosor5 (original poster) »

Ah, I see. Would you say the Speedster is capable of producing lever-style shots with its idromatic component? Basically you do like 12 second preinfusion, maybe 5 seconds at 9 bars and then go back to preinfusion mode in order to get a declining profile until you hit your target. If not, what are the taste notes like compared to an E61 grp head and a spring-lever machine?

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JohnB.
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#4: Post by JohnB. replying to klosor5 »

With the large PPIC on the 2020 Speedster there is no need for the Idro Matic. You could pull a shot as you describe although you wouldn't get much with only 5 seconds at full pressure. Typical ramp to full pressure just using the pump setting (no manual pi) is 10-12 seconds. Normal Speedster shots are in the 45 second range. Comparing coffees between my spring lever & my Speedster the Speedster will always bring out more individual flavors.
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BaristaBoy E61
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#5: Post by BaristaBoy E61 »

klosor5 wrote:Most people seem seriously disinformed in regards to the shot profiling it does (Claiming it only can do a flat 9-bar shot for instance, even though the Idromatic extension makes this the most versatile high-end machine behind the Decent and GS3 MP, although its stepped design makes it way more consistent than the GS3).

My understanding is that it's a version of the E61, but I also read somewhere that the Spirit uses a Saturated grouphead design, but since Saturated grouphead designs produce better quality shots, it would make sense to me that the Speedster also has this.

How is temperature stability achieved and how is it different to other machines? Kees seemed keen on head exchangers (thermal syphoning) in order to achieve some of that stability in an interview but I didn't really get much more detail out of it.

I also read that the Speedster doesn't require any flushing before shotpulling, but I can't confirm anything with so little information and I haven't gotten a response when I last sent an e-mail.
klosor5 wrote:Ah, I see. Would you say the Speedster is capable of producing lever-style shots with its idromatic component? Basically you do like 12 second preinfusion, maybe 5 seconds at 9 bars and then go back to preinfusion mode in order to get a declining profile until you hit your target. If not, what are the taste notes like compared to an E61 grp head and a spring-lever machine?
The Speedster group head is quite different from the E61 brew head. Perhaps you're referring to the earlier KvdW Mirage series that did use the E61 group. Superior temperature stability is probably achieved by better water management and flow through the saturated head from the brew boiler as well as by perhaps better PID devices.

I don't do any flushing before pulling shots, when the PID display says it's up to temperature - it's ready to go. That's no more than 15-minutes from a cold start, brew and steam. I might use hot water from the hot water spigot for the 1st shot to fully warm up the cup for the 1st shot of the session but that's it.

John is in a better position to answer the comparison between Speedster shots and lever shots. I do feel the Idromatic head does offer yet another extended stage and range of soft-infusion that I feel is of value. Kees seems to have gotten many things (really, everything) right with regard to soft-preinfusion to not damage or destroy puck integrity and it's done in a completely analogue, progressive fashion that has its own smooth, linear flow.

It's very hard to ruin a shot unless it's done during the puck prep phase or the machine wasn't given its 15-min to heat up. My wife says she pulls goods shots when I'm not around - and doesn't bother doing any of the puck prep nonsense at I do or even line-level pre-infusions.

The Speedster is designed to do many things that few other machines do any of, such as, the pump will not fill the steam boiler during any phase of pulling a shot once you've started the process.

We do have consistently great shots from a local café that has a multi-group LM Strada Volumetric and either a Mahlkonig E65S GBW or a Mahlkonig E80 GBW (I can't remember). Now that they know we have a 2020 Speedster Idromatic, they let me pull my own shots if they're not too busy - and I have to fight with them to take our money!
"You didn't buy an Espresso Machine - You bought a Chemistry Set!"

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JohnB.
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#6: Post by JohnB. »

BaristaBoy E61 wrote:
I don't do any flushing before pulling shots, when the PID display says it's up to temperature - it's ready to go. That's no more than 15-minutes from a cold start, brew and steam. I might use hot water from the hot water spigot for the 1st shot to fully warm up the cup for the 1st shot of the session but that's it.
The boilers will be up to temp in 15 minutes but it takes close to 90 minutes for the Speedster to be fully temp stable. When the side covers are hot you are there.
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BaristaBoy E61
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#7: Post by BaristaBoy E61 »

Thanks John, good to know!
"You didn't buy an Espresso Machine - You bought a Chemistry Set!"