Profitec Pro 600 Review from a Pro 500 Vet. - Page 2

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Bluenoser

#11: Post by Bluenoser »

homeslice wrote:Regarding my pro500 Purging the hx machine on first shots dropped the temp to appropriate heat. The second shots without purge were at similar temp. I didn't need rebound time more than 3 minutes
If you don't have a group thermometer on your HX, you don't really know if your brew water might be dipping on successive shots.. (you should not need to flush initially.. that is the idea of the Pro500.. maybe a short 3 second if its been on for an hour). mine dips 5F degrees after each shot but there is not much taste difference from 200 to 195 for shot #2.. On shot #3, mine is 190F and shots are sour.. (that's where I need the 10-15 minute wait) So your Pro600 is going to perform much better here.. but you can't really quantify that unless you measure the temps accurately. I agree Profitec does little to inform consumers of what performance expectations should be for its machines.

PIXIllate
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#12: Post by PIXIllate »

Plinyyounger wrote:This isn't going to go well, lol.
Ha!

[Shrugs. Leaves conversation.]

Gargamel40

#13: Post by Gargamel40 »

Is there really a difference in milk foam/quality if you steam it with 2 bar or with 1.4 bar?

All reviews were talking about stability and how you can pull an espresso right after steaming milk. Now if you accept 1.4 bar instead of 2 bar, you can steam milk, do espresso anytime you want. I wouldn't make Americanos with water from a espresso machine. It's not good tasting, because it comes from steaming boiler. It's the same on any espresso machine there is i think.

Sure 2 bar is a gimmick but you have 1.4 bar any time. Pro500 not so much. It's the same in any business/marketing.

Gargamel40

#14: Post by Gargamel40 »

I was reading the internet heavily before pulling the trigger on my espresso machine. No manufacturer gives that kind of details.

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JB90068
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#15: Post by JB90068 »

So does this boil down to:
1. For the extra $400. spent you don't feel that there are enough differences between the two models to warrant the extra money?
2. You feel that Profitec has misrepresented this model because they market the steam boiler being capable of 2 bars output?
3. You user experience steaming milk below 2 bars is unsatisfactory?
4. All of the above?

I'm asking because I'm curious and more specifically if it relates to #3. I have a Synchronika (same company) and I regularly steam milk below 1.5 bars and it doesn't impact my experience negatively.
Old baristas never die. They just become over extracted.

homeslice (original poster)

#16: Post by homeslice (original poster) »

So does this boil down to:
1. For the extra $400. spent you don't feel that there are enough differences between the two models to warrant the extra money?
2. You feel that Profitec has misrepresented this model because they market the steam boiler being capable of 2 bars output?
3. You user experience steaming milk below 2 bars is unsatisfactory?
4. All of the above?

I don't believe the extra $400 matters if those differences aren't staple ease of using the machine. Nobody wants to realize there's a catch to the extra being spent.
I believe Profitec misrepresented this model because of the 2 bar rebound issue and its inability to produce more than one drink without complete loss of various drink capabilities. Nobody would compromise with that from a $2400+ machine.
Yes not getting what was advertised without unreasonable rebound time is a problem.

Remember that people come here to this forum for user experiences they won't get from a demo at a store or on a sellers video and could be helpful in making decisions when buying a machine. Especially if it's going to be used daily. I posted my experience. I don't need to be sold by dealers (and I'm sure there's a few on here) to convince me to accept them after the fact.

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JB90068
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#17: Post by JB90068 »

I'm not disputing your reasons for your review and instead applaud you for it. What I don't understand though is why your 600 doesn't recharge fast enough for you to make multiple drinks back to back, which is what it sounds like. Your machine and mine are very similar and to the best of my knowledge have many of the same internal components. Where I'm confused is that I have no problem pulling multiple shots and steaming milk for two or more drinks back to back even though I have purposely set the pressure to 1.5 bars. At times it will fall to 1 bar, but that still doesn't stop me from making cappuccinos which require more steam. I'm not concerned if it adds a few extra seconds to my workflow because like yourself, I'm only making two drinks at a time.

You say you are struggling to make back to back drinks. To me, that sounds like it's a mechanical problem with the machine or could be related to the steam tip and it needs to be fixed. If you are just PO'd because your steam gauge doesn't stay at 2 bars and you feel like you were lied to, that's a different issue.
Old baristas never die. They just become over extracted.

Gargamel40

#18: Post by Gargamel40 »

He wants to make back to back drinks with constant 2 bar pressure. If he would make them with 1.5 bar, he wouldn't have a problem. But he wants "advertised" 2 bar pressure with every drink back to back.

It's childish, specially if you can stream at 1.5 bar back to back. There is no difference in taste look. Profitec also doesn't advertise 2 bar back to back pressure anywhere. Vendors do and even they write about "up to" 2 bar pressure.

Bluenoser

#19: Post by Bluenoser »

The boiler pressure should have no effect on the brew boiler making back to back shots. I'm not sure how priority is programmed but I'm guessing the brew boiler would have priority so you should be able to make back to back shots forever with a 3 min wait. Now steaming you might be between 1.4 and 2 but there is no reason to wait to steam. Maybe I am missing something.

homeslice (original poster)

#20: Post by homeslice (original poster) »

JB90068 wrote:I'm not disputing your reasons for your review and instead applaud you for it. What I don't understand though is why your 600 doesn't recharge fast enough for you to make multiple drinks back to back, which is what it sounds like. Your machine and mine are very similar and to the best of my knowledge have many of the same internal components. Where I'm confused is that I have no problem pulling multiple shots and steaming milk for two or more drinks back to back even though I have purposely set the pressure to 1.5 bars. At times it will fall to 1 bar, but that still doesn't stop me from making cappuccinos which require more steam. I'm not concerned if it adds a few extra seconds to my workflow because like yourself, I'm only making two drinks at a time.

You say you are struggling to make back to back drinks. To me, that sounds like it's a mechanical problem with the machine or could be related to the steam tip and it needs to be fixed. If you are just PO'd because your steam gauge doesn't stay at 2 bars and you feel like you were lied to, that's a different issue.
Gargamel40 wrote: He wants to make back to back drinks with constant 2 bar pressure. If he would make them with 1.5 bar, he wouldn't have a problem. But he wants "advertised" 2 bar pressure with every drink back to back.

It's childish, specially if you can stream at 1.5 bar back to back. There is no difference in taste look. Profitec also doesn't advertise 2 bar back to back pressure anywhere. Vendors do and even they write about "up to" 2 bar pressure.
First off Gargamel40 get it through your head that dealers don't discuss details of efficient function from back-to-back drinks to each machine they're selling and nobody gets the experience from a Profitec website. You always buy cars purely off everything posted on the website and get everything you want from it alone? You'd be a first. If people are going to see the features provided they should be seeing what this proclaimed DB can do and that is from more than one extraction, including DIFFERENT DRINKS.
JB90068 wrote:I'm not disputing your reasons for your review and instead applaud you for it. What I don't understand though is why your 600 doesn't recharge fast enough for you to make multiple drinks back to back, which is what it sounds like. Your machine and mine are very similar and to the best of my knowledge have many of the same internal components. Where I'm confused is that I have no problem pulling multiple shots and steaming milk for two or more drinks back to back even though I have purposely set the pressure to 1.5 bars. At times it will fall to 1 bar, but that still doesn't stop me from making cappuccinos which require more steam. I'm not concerned if it adds a few extra seconds to my workflow because like yourself, I'm only making two drinks at a time.

You say you are struggling to make back to back drinks. To me, that sounds like it's a mechanical problem with the machine or could be related to the steam tip and it needs to be fixed. If you are just PO'd because your steam gauge doesn't stay at 2 bars and you feel like you were lied to, that's a different issue.
JB90068 I am making two drinks at once, an Americano and a latte which I have to make the latte first before the Americano seeps the machine entirely of pressure for 5 minutes. Yes, 5 minutes to get 2 bar and 4 to get 1.6. As if waiting for that makes any sense, beginner or not.

I think the more common problem many here criticizing reviews for (a notorious problem to this forum I backed out long ago over) was that "drinks" is a broad term determining rebound time even dealers never discuss with their customers. Lattes aren't a problem back-to-back since I have a few years making drinks on home espresso machines and know what to expect from routine practice. For the 600 it's the Americanos that make the db a "faux" db. An issue I never had with my HX pro500. So accepting less performance to a more expensive model isn't acceptable. It's a faux DB at a $2400 pricetag that can't be argued. Profitec's attempt at delivering a db unit in a HX shell (to likely save costs) is a poor design with a boiler pid unit to make up for it. Happy with the PID but the machine needs improvements.

A newcomer would likely accept these issues if the 600 was their first espresso machine or perhaps coming from a Silvia. Anything that doesn't take 8 minutes a drink is fast. I could dish out both an americano and latte I was satisfied with in less than 8 minutes with the 500. The 600 needs particular order to get the most out of the unit which takes longer and I don't buy dealers are discussing that. I don't feel like I was lied to. I feel like I wasn't told what to expect and that's what consumer always want, especially going for a pro "upgrade" by a dealer and not directly online. I explained order to try getting the best out of the unit in reasonable time which it struggles with in my review. Newcomers, enjoy it and message me with anymore questions. The few else that don't like it, deal with it.