Hello All! First post, but this sight has been a wealth of information. Anyway I need your help my fellow home baristas even the pros if you are on here. LOL

I recently purchased a Profitec Pro 500 along with a Fiorenzato 4E Nano. I have set it up and since been trying to dial-in my grind. However, I cannot get the 500 to extract at 9-10 bars of pressure. I am using the double portafilter, measuring out 17g of coffee using varying degrees of tamping pressure but the brew pressure gauge never goes past 5. Now I have checked the brew group pressure with the back flush disc and it shoots to 10 bar. It is taking 20 seconds to pull a shot with the first drip at 5 seconds. I am using 2 measured shot glasses which give me 1oz of coffee and 0.5oz of crema.

Now I have been told that I need to adjust the grind finer but I am at the point now were I am just about grinding the burrs (churping). Any help would be appreciated. The companies I bought the items from have not been able to solve this mystery.

Do you have a scale at home that could be used to see if you can hit something like 30 pounds of tamping force? I'd suspect that any amount of force at the finest grind would be OK but, even though 30 isn't required by any means, it is kind of a benchmark often mentioned.

Are the grounds in the basket evenly distributed before tamping? Use a needle of some sort to stir them around to be sure. Look up "WDT" here. You could be doing something called channeling - think of it as a crack in the puck that all the water gushes through.

There's a chance the grinder is not at its finest setting, or there's an issue with it getting there. I'm not familiar with that one.

FWIW you are on the right path...

Do you have a scale? It's best to weigh input/ output, volume is not as accurate. What size portafilter basket are you using? 17 grams might not be enough for the size basket you're using, you might need to up dose a bit more. Are you using fresh beans? Older or lightly roasted bean usually need to be ground finer than fresher or darker roasted beans. It's best to change only one variable at a time (amount of coffee, grind adjustment, tamp pressure). If you think you're at or as close to the finest as you can grind, I'd change the dose. Don't get too hung up on tamping, a level distribution and level tamp is more important than the pressure. Good luck and don't get frustrated, it takes time.

As my Signature shows, I have the same machine and a Quamar grinder. WHL set the pressure on the gauge to something like 12 to get 10 at the brew head as I recall. Anyway, I suspect you need better distribution to stop channeling or a finer grind. I do 15 or 16g in my 15g VST double basket and get 30g shots in 25 seconds +/- a couple no problem. I did 17g routinely with the supplied double basket with great results as well. As the previous poster said, look up WDT and try that. I usually tamp pretty light: way under 30lbs. I always weigh my doses within 0.1g. YMMV

Let us know

I've got a Pro 500 and can tamp with about 10 lbs pressure and can get the dial to go to 9 bar..

Yes.. weigh the output.. get a cheapo Walmart scale that measures to 0.01g (.1 is fine, but 0.01 scales are common to find)

But if you are at the finest setting on the grinder and you can only get as slow as 20 sec there is something wrong with grinder. You should be able to grind fine enough so 34g output can happen in 30-40 seconds. First drip at 5 seconds seems not too bad.. I think ideally it should be 6-9 seconds..

If you have a bottomless portafilter, that will tell if you have a lot of channeling.. I found the scale and bottomless portafilter crucial when I was starting out with my machine.

Any chance you are leaking pressure around where the portafilter attaches to the group? Think you'd see some water dripping out.

If you can find anyone with a 'working' espresso grinder, get them to grind you about 20g of something that would be 'too fine' on their machine and see what happens on yours.. or have them bring it over. This might help point to a grinder issue or machine issue. (likely could get a coffee shop to grind you some)

I would like to thank everyone for their input. I carefully took everyone's suggestions into account. It was Cafe102's suggestion about the beans that finally helped solved the problem. When I set out on this journey to espresso nirvana I decided to buy Maromas Orphea as my first choice. This was based on its flavor characteristics with milk based drinks. So I decided to empty out my grinder and fill it with some Roastmaster's Blend Mayorga Whole Bean coffee which I use during the weekdays. I use an Oxo burr coffee grinder to make regular coffee.

I emptied out the Orphea and filled the hopper with Mayorga. I used the same grind setting and same coffee weight (17g). I noticed immediately the grind was much finer. I tamped at the same pressure. This time the brew pressure gauge made it up to 10 bar. Shot time was now 25 seconds.

I cannot believe it! Does the type of coffee bean really matter that much? I would welcome any suggestions on what coffee's to try next. Again thanks to everyone for their suggestions.

yes..

When I do decaf beans, I need to grind much, much finer .. the roast level also have much to do with grind level. That is why there is a whole process to "dialing in" a bean.

Sometimes hard bits of the bean get jammed in the grinder, so make a habit of thoroughly cleaning the grinder each month. And by cleaning, I mean get some good denture brushes and take apart the top of the grinder and brush the burrs. Make sure you know the recommended cleaning procedure so you don't change the alignment of the burrs.. But I clean my Sette every month and makes quite a difference in the grind quality.

If you cleaned your grinder, that might have had an effect on your final success.

consider getting a 'naked' portafilter. An extra cost but the only tool to really tell you if you are distributing your grinds properly in the basket. If you are getting channeling, it will be there with every bean.

On my website www.EspressoMyEspresso.com, check out this article: 12 - EASY GUIDE TO BETTER ESPRESSO AT HOME

But freshly roasted (and properly roasted) quality coffee beans is always the place to start.

I've noticed on my Pro 500 that if I use fresh beans, WDT, distribution/leveler tool, and 18g + - 1g in an 18g VST basket that tamping pressure seems to be mostly inconsequential as long as I keep it level.