dndrich wrote:The water dispenser is the thing on the left that dispenses hot water for tea or americanos. It is not the group head or the steam wand. The Elizabeth cleverly uses the steam boiler to put water into the brew boiler and then out the water dispenser at just the right temperature without spitting like most hot water dispensers on any other espresso machine. It is very clever. Also, with the steam boiler off, which is easy to turn off on the Elizabeth, you can still get hot water from the dispenser. Elizabeth is the only machine that does this.

Okay I get what you are saying. I did know where the water dispenser is located, but wasn't quite sure what you meant at first. I've only used the water dispenser maybe a couple times in the almost a year of owning this machine.

dndrich wrote:OK, I only have 3 months experience, but here goes...

1: The overshoot heating is a feature. You want it to heat up so that the portafilter and semi-saturated group reach temperature. It takes about 20 minutes. I have mine set to show the actual temperature, so I can see the overshoot, and then am ready to pull when it hits my target. No E61 machine will be ready sooner. And, the temperature is really stable.

Will you only be able to pull a shot after the cool down has occurred? If yes, why is the Elizabeth advertised with 10 min warmup, I don't see the huge benefit over an e61 in terms of warmup. What am I missing?

dndrich wrote:The water dispenser is the thing on the left that dispenses hot water for tea or americanos. It is not the group head or the steam wand. The Elizabeth cleverly uses the steam boiler to put water into the brew boiler and then out the water dispenser at just the right temperature without spitting like most hot water dispensers on any other espresso machine. It is very clever. Also, with the steam boiler off, which is easy to turn off on the Elizabeth, you can still get hot water from the dispenser. Elizabeth is the only machine that does this.

I wish Lelit used a physical knob to control hot water flow, like they do with their lower-end machines. This way you could use it to control flow during the shot (at the price of filling the drip tray more quickly). As far as I understand the Breville Dual Boiler's Slayer mod is basically this concept, just with rerouting the water back to the water tank instead of the drip tray. It's the only major advantage I see in it over the Elizabeth (and the reason why I'm still undecided between these two machines as an upgrade to my Quick Mill Alexia Evo).

oksako wrote:Will you only be able to pull a shot after the cool down has occurred? If yes, why is the Elizabeth advertised with 10 min warmup, I don't see the huge benefit over an e61 in terms of warmup. What am I missing?

You can pull a shot early if you purge the group head. I was not aware that Elizabeth is advertised with a 10 minute warmup. 20 minutes is correct. Most E61 machines are 30-40 minutes or longer. The only exceptions to this are the Mara X and perhaps the Bezzera machines with their electric E61 group heads. I turn mine on in the morning, and since it sips electricity it is cheap to run and ready all day. Furthermore, it is so easy to turn off the steam boiler, that you can run it with the steam boiler off, and if you want to steam, turn on the boiler and it is ready in under 5 minutes. One of the reasons I bought the Elizabeth is the quick warm up time. It has not disappointed.

Excuse me I have to correct what I have written. Lelit doesn't advertise it with 10 minutes. I think there are just many resources with a bit of misleading formulations. For instance, lelit themselves (?) on YouTube (the channel lelit inside): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlXIPdLjZuM
The title says pl92t elizabeth warm up and 1st coffee (10minutee for 220-240v - 11 minutes for 120v). However at the end of the video also purging is performed to reduce the temp. So no blaim against lelits advertising.

Can someone explain me why the steaming preinfusuion of elizabeth is so nice (holding the pressure)? Is this so different from other preinfusuion methods?

Yes, it is. No other machine like it. It has to do with the clever Lelit control center software and solenoid valves. You can program it in the advanced settings per Dave Corby recommendations to your desire although it works right out of the box. Best to have the pump run for 3 seconds though, which requires the advanced settings. Mine came out of the box at 1 second, which I changed. They have come up with a very clever method of doing this, which allows for a nice pre infusion. Note that the steam is simply pressurizing the brew boiler via a solenoid connection, and it is the brew boiler water that is doing the pre infusion so that the temperature is correct. This ability to use the steam boiler to pressurize brew boiler water via a solenoid is also why the water dispenser is so nice too. Other espresso machines use the steam boiler only to give you hot water through the dispenser, which is why it sputters and splatters. Not the Elizabeth. Plumbed machines can use the tap water pressure to allow for pre infusion, but a tank machine cannot. The new Rancilio Silvia Pro X has a pre infusion mode, but it is nothing like that of the Elizabeth. It just wets the puck by running the pump a bit. Elizabeth can do that too if you want. So, a very interesting machine for sure, and I have really enjoyed it. They have made the most out this small footprint. I think there is no other machine in this price range with similar value for my needs.

Just saying but the BDB stock (disregarding even Slayer mod) with its PI is still another league beyond the Elizabeth, that's the one where no machine under 2k and heck many over aren't near in performance with that. You have full manual control of the PI and can adjust all the way down to 55%, heck can even do a pull like that and not just PI, want to do say 75% pressure flow for entire shot can just by holding manual button. Only machine that can do similar and more in that range is thr Decent.

But vs something like the 300 or new Silvia, yeah, Elizabeth had a big edge over those with that. I checked out an Elizabeth before, if it weren't for the BDB in that range, I'd easily go Liz over other competitors. I had a 300 and hated it.

What they should do is in future develop the Elizabeths unique PI system to allow longer and further customized use for new machines, that would be cool to see

cmin wrote:Just saying but the BDB stock (disregarding even Slayer mod) with its PI is still another league beyond the Elizabeth, that's the one where no machine under 2k and heck many over aren't near in performance with that. You have full manual control of the PI and can adjust all the way down to 55%, heck can even do a pull like that and not just PI, want to do say 75% pressure flow for entire shot can just by holding manual button. Only machine that can do similar and more in that range is thr Decent.

But vs something like the 300 or new Silvia, yeah, Elizabeth had a big edge over those with that. I checked out an Elizabeth before, if it weren't for the BDB in that range, I'd easily go Liz over other competitors. I had a 300 and hated it.

I have no experience with the BDB, but many folks love it. One practical thing that seems nice is that you can see the water level in the tank from the front. The Elizabeth does not have that. I liked the build quality of the Barista Express for the price. I would expect the BDB to be considerably better than that. My only complaint is it looks a bit appliance like, but that really should not matter. Performance and ease of use are really key. Nice that there are good choices in this price range.

Does anyone know which pressure the pressure gauge exactly shows?

I have a couple of questions for those who upgraded to the IMS Shower Screen. I received mine and I'm not sure about two things:

1) Is the shower screen supposed to be tightened until the outer part is in contact with the brass bloc (and secure enough) or until the whole screen becomes flat (until if can no longer be tightened). Since the stock screen is concave, I figured it was the first option but I was curious what you guys did.

2) Anyone found a better screw option that fits better with the screen? The stock one works but the angle is not quite right and it stick out a bit. I does not leave an indent on the dry puck but it does on the wet puck. It's annoying me a bit.