I've watched a lot of videos of these two machines, and from what I gather, people who pressure profile on Profitec, start from 0 bars and gradually ramp up to 9 bars to gently infuse the puck.

People who pressure profile on Lelit Bianca, start at full throttle 11 bars.

I'm confused by the diametrically contrasting methodology.

I'm further confused by the Lelit's pre-infusion feature on the PID... ? So if you set it for 5 seconds, it infuses it at 11 bars? And then when it cuts off, does it suck up the espresso grounds into the shower screen and ruin the puck?

I don't think the way you pressure profile depends on the machine at all.

To me it makes sense to start with full flow in order to fill the empty space above the puck as evenly as possible. When the pressure needle starts moving from 0 I cut the flow because then I know the water has evenly coated the puck. After that it's just matter of preinfusing in which ever way works for the particular coffee.

My go-to is to ramp up to full flow when first drops hit the cup, usually around 1-2 bars and 15 sec. But for some coffees I might keep it for longer at 2-3 bars and for some coffees I might cut the flow all together to let the puck soak.

Usually I also taper the flow towards the end so that I end up with 4-6 bars when the shot is finished at the desired output weight.

I don't see how same profile could result in different results with different machines.

I'm further confused by the Lelit's pre-infusion feature on the PID... ? So if you set it for 5 seconds, it infuses it at 11 bars? And then when it cuts off, does it suck up the espresso grounds into the shower screen and ruin the puck?

No, this is only something that some lever machine users have to watch out for. In a pump machine decreasing the pressure, however suddenly and to whatever extent, is not going to suck the puck up to the screen. In some lever machines, reraising the lever creates a negative pressure that can open fissures in a puck.

I agree with the other poster that both the Lelit and the other similar machines can be used in many different ways. Because one finds a bunch of videos doing it one way or another, does not mean that this is a trend. The confidence level of such sampling is near zero. I have used the profiling on my Synchronika in many different ways since I installed it. Had I posted a video of one of them it is no assurance that this is how I always do it.

jpetrow wrote:I don't think the way you pressure profile depends on the machine at all.

To me it makes sense to start with full flow in order to fill the empty space above the puck as evenly as possible. When the pressure needle starts moving from 0 I cut the flow because then I know the water has evenly coated the puck. After that it's just matter of preinfusing in which ever way works for the particular coffee.

My go-to is to ramp up to full flow when first drops hit the cup, usually around 1-2 bars and 15 sec. But for some coffees I might keep it for longer at 2-3 bars and for some coffees I might cut the flow all together to let the puck soak.

Usually I also taper the flow towards the end so that I end up with 4-6 bars when the shot is finished at the desired output weight.

I don't see how same profile could result in different results with different machines.

Do you have a Bianca or Profitec 700? I'm curious which machine you're talking about.

If you're talking about Bianca, I have a question... when you move the wooden paddle all the way to the left, this moves the pressure to 0 bars, correct? If so, is there still water flowing from the grouphead? Or does water supply get cut off at 0 bars? I'm trying to figure out if there's a difference between pre-infusion through PID where you set infusion time and dwell time, and then just manually moving the paddle to 0 bars for dwell time.

Nunas wrote:No, this is only something that some lever machine users have to watch out for. In a pump machine decreasing the pressure, however suddenly and to whatever extent, is not going to suck the puck up to the screen. In some lever machines, reraising the lever creates a negative pressure that can open fissures in a puck.

I agree with the other poster that both the Lelit and the other similar machines can be used in many different ways. Because one finds a bunch of videos doing it one way or another, does not mean that this is a trend. The confidence level of such sampling is near zero. I have used the profiling on my Synchronika in many different ways since I installed it. Had I posted a video of one of them it is no assurance that this is how I always do it.

I'm confused. I thought the advantage of a lever machine was that it doesn't suck up the coffee grounds after the extraction?

I have another question that I addressed to the other poster. When you move the pressure profiling paddle to 0 bars, does it also cut off water supply? I ask, because for Bianca, there's a pre-infusion option on the PID. I'm trying to figure out what's the difference between pre-infusion via PID and manually moving the paddle to 0 bars for dwell time.

epictek wrote:Do you have a Bianca or Profitec 700? I'm curious which machine you're talking about.

If you're talking about Bianca, I have a question... when you move the wooden paddle all the way to the left, this moves the pressure to 0 bars, correct? If so, is there still water flowing from the grouphead? Or does water supply get cut off at 0 bars? I'm trying to figure out if there's a difference between pre-infusion through PID where you set infusion time and dwell time, and then just manually moving the paddle to 0 bars for dwell time.

There should be no flow with the paddle closed, though one can adjust this by repositioning the paddle on the spline.

The same things can be accomplished either manually or using the automatic (programmed) pre-infusion. Automatic is good for ease and repeatability.

I think there is some confusion as to what the paddle on the Bianca does. The Bianca paddle is a needle valve that adjust the flow of water (not pump pressure) which will then affect the pressure indirectly. Turning it to the left/off position cuts the flow of water. If pressure has built up in the group head cutting the water flow keeps the pressure from rising further. The pressure will then usually decline naturally as the flow through the puck changes while absorbing the water and the puck's resistance decreases.

I did a detailed review, with video on the Bianca, the OP really needs to read that to understand what it can do. I know it's for the UK model, but the US one can't be much different. It's a long review but informative.

https://coffeeequipmentreviews.wordpres ... it-bianca/

I thought the advantage of a lever machine was that it doesn't suck up the coffee grounds after the extraction?

It depends on the lever machine and how it's operated. It's fairly common practice to lift the lever a second time, either fully or partially, to get more water through the puck. On some machines when this is done, depending on how it's done, the puck can fracture. What you may be thinking of is a 3-way valve. Generally, lever machines don't have them and one has to wait for the pressure to subside to open the PF. I'm far from a lever machine expert...just going by the ones I have.

I did a detailed review, with video on the Bianca

Nice job, Dave.