jesawdy wrote:Dan, I am curious to know if a Cimbali Junior landed on your doorstep today, do you think it would still reveal flaws in your technique? Do you think it is that unforgiving, or had you simply developed some bad habits that did not reveal themselves on a machine with E61-style preinfusion?

Although my techniques and consistency (hopefully) improve over time, I believe that it would not be difficult to reaffirm the Cimbali Junior conclusion as written. To be honest, I consider myself just an "average" barista by this site's standards. My typical shot is a 3.0 to 3.5; I enjoy a few 4s per month (scoring explanation).

The review of the Cimbali Junior remains the most thoroughly researched of all the site's reviews. I loaned it to three other local home baristas before the conclusion was written; they independently confirmed my assessment. I'm intrigued by the work that Ken has done to improve his Junior's forgiveness factor by prolonging the preinfusion time, but as discussed in Pressure profiles, preinfusion and the forgiveness factor, I don't think that's the only way.

T.J. wrote:Thank you all for your enthusiasm....I hope to keep you posted of any new information we may have to share with you.

Thanks T.J. for sharing the news about Cimbali's plans to develop a more "barista friendly" design. I will follow your updates with great interest.

Like others who have responded to the OP, I also have owned an M21 Cimbali. It is a fine machine and IMO there is not another machine on the planet with its build quality. (admittedly, I have not peeked under the hood of a GS3).

Ken is the Cimbali master here and has come close to reaching nirvana with his Juniors. I do not have his technical expertise nor his patience in wringing every ounce of performance from a Cimabali. For an impatient one such as I, the machine needs to be as close to perfect as possible right out of the box with a minimum of fuss and muss.

Forgiving you ask? The current pony in my stable is an A3. I personally find it more tolerant of my lapses in barista technique that my M21 was. But maybe that's just me.

The price point of roughly 3K is the same for the A3 and an M21. Sure, you have the luxury of a local Cimbali dealer and that's worth a lot, but I have found Chris to have, well, as he says, service second to none. So I wouldn't hesitate to buy from Chris if the A3 caught your eye.

TJ, an upgraded M21 on the way? Hmmm, I've been wondering what to do with all of my spare pocket change!

So I call chris coffee to order the S1 and there and everyone else are out of stock for at least a month. So now what?

Brett P.

podo98 wrote:So I call chris coffee to order the S1 and there and everyone else are out of stock for at least a month. So now what?

Based on reading everything ever written about anything (ok, I read all the HB reviews and archives and talked with dealers), I'd spring the extra $$ and get the A3 from chriscoffee. I just bought some toys from them, and it was actually fun, as opposed to some places I've dealt with. Plus, I think the prices are about to go up on the imports, so early bird and all that...

Oh, why the A3? Excellent ergonomics, solid build, and apparently a tendency toward sweet, coffee-like extraction. If I hadn't already bought a big Cimbali, that's what I would have done.

Eric

I love the A3, and while I can plumb the water line, I cannot plumb the drain. My understanding is that both need to be plumbed.

BP

T.J. wrote:We also find that the odor and taste of stale water that emanates from dual boiler systems is not an attribute concerning taste.

timo888 wrote:I thought the La Spaziale had a 450ml (i.e. rather small) boiler. How is it that so little water becomes stale?

Yeah, no kidding!
I've never had bad tasting water come out of my machines.

Compass Coffee wrote:However it could be an issue in home use for some with a larger brew boiler like Brewtus.

I can confirm that staling is not an issue even with the Techno's 1.4 liter copper brew boiler. I base this on the standard test in which one pulls a blank shot, allows the water to cool, then tastes it. I'm not sure whether the temperature or head-space changes it, but the water from the steam/hot water boiler definitely has an off taste and the brew boiler definitely does not.

Best,
David