As I seek to understand all of the different options with espresso machines, I'm wondering how long it takes for single boiler dual use (SBDU) machines to switch from brew temperature to steam temperature? Also if you've developed a workflow that leverages this machines capabilities to the best for milk inclusion, how do you do that?

This is highly variable.

I can only speak directly to the machines I've owned/used over the years, but typically I've found that if I switch it to steam, I've had time to turn around, grab the pitcher from the freezer, pour some milk in it, turn back around, purge the wand for as long as it takes to get rid of the water, and then steam straight away, plus or minus a few seconds.

This has applied to numerous (Saeco) Baristas with stamped SS clamshell boilers, multiple FFX5 machines with brass boilers, a V2 Silvia and an early (1970-something) Gaggia baby. They all performed similarly and predictably such that I could tailor my routine to be ready to steam when I needed it.

The time is primarily a function of boiler capacity divided by heating element power. The larger the boiler, the more heating element required to maintain the desired time. I think most SBDU boiler machines have maintained similar design criteria to ensure a good workflow, but some do perform better than others...

One of the biggest items of note is the importance of starting to steam before the heating element cycles off. Folks who wait for the indicator to suggest that the machine is "ready" to steam will be met with frustration. Steaming with the element on is the only way to go. If you miss the window, you're best off to wait out the cycle and even short the cycle by engaging the pump for a second to drop the temperature and start again...

Cheers!

- Jake

Wow, that sounds really quick. Thanks for posting Jake!

You need to master the workflow for each machine. Those that pump hot water through the steam wand are easy to control, especially with a PID. Grind and dose into the heated PF while taking it up to steam temp. Foam your milk, then flip the switches to the hot water position and purge the wand into something like a big plastic hot drink mug with the pump. Watch the temp on the PID, and shut off the flow when it's down to about 10-12 degrees above brew temp. It took about 15 seconds on my SBDU machines. Lock the PF back in, clean the wand with the hot water in the mug and a towel, and you'll be ready to brew. Some think the PF will get too hot if you lock it in before bringing the temp back down, but it didn't seem to make a difference to me.

Just flipping the switch and waiting for the temp to go from brew to steam or the other way around seemed like forever to me.

Interesting David, so steam first for you. Thanks for posting!

My classic is v fast with an Auber PID with steam function. Gets up to 155 while I pour milk into a pitcher, I purge and ready to go. For multiple drinks, I pull each one then do the milk.

I have found over the years (good) coffee tastes way better warm than hot so I don't worry about keeping things hot anymore.

Another fast one. Thanks David!

Jake_G wrote:I can only speak directly to the machines I've owned/used over the years, but typically I've found that if I switch it to steam, I've had time to turn around, grab the pitcher from the freezer, pour some milk in it, turn back around, purge the wand for as long as it takes to get rid of the water, and then steam straight away, plus or minus a few seconds.

Wouldn't it be better to do all this before you brew the espresso, so that when you flip the switch everything is ready and you can start steaming as soon as you consider the machine to be ready?

And to answer the OP, the last SBDU machine I had was a Gaggia Tebe and there it usually took 30 seconds until I could start steaming, which was 5 seconds before the thermostat would turn the heater off. I have a Quick Mill Alexia Evo on the way which will be my next SBDU (I don't consider the MCaL to be one, as it's possible to steam and brew at the same time with that machine). I'll be able to update about the time it takes the Quick Mill in a few days. I'm planning to test the machine steaming, but don't expect to use it, as I plan to continue to use the MCaL for this.

bluesman wrote:You need to master the workflow for each machine. Those that pump hot water through the steam wand are easy to control, especially with a PID.

I assume you mean those that can pump hot water through the steam wand while in coffee brewing mode? (I initially read this as machines that use the pump while you steam).

boren wrote: Wouldn't it be better to do all this before you brew the espresso, so that when you flip the switch everything is ready and you can start steaming as soon as you consider the machine to be ready?

I found in my workflow with the aforementioned machines that I considered the machine to be ready after I did all the above. As such, I saved time by doing those tasks while the machine heated up. It all happened pretty quick so I didn't put too much thought into it. I'm not a big fan of waiting, so once I figured out how long it took, I figured out what could reliably be done during that time. Now I have a 5 liter boiler ready to go whenever I want, so I do prep my milk prior to prepping my shot these days

Cheers!

- Jake