HB wrote:There's nothing peculiar about an espresso machine hookup compared to the various kitchen and bathroom appliances, so any licensed plumber should know how to do the work. How close the nearest water supply and drain are to your desired espresso machine location will have a big impact on the price they quote. If it's right next to a kitchen sink, it's easy peasy. If it required cutting into walls and floors, it will get expensive quickly (IIRC, the going rate around here is $125/hour).

I believe it's worth insisting the plumber obtain proper permits from your city's building inspection department. Some plumbers will balk at pulling permits because it means potential return trips before they get paid. But in the unlikely event there's a failure leading to water damage, your insurance company is less likely to fuss about the claim if the install was on the up-and-up. For example, in our state, a homeowner isn't required to get an inspection if it's their primary residence. One caveat though is if the homeowner later sells, all modifications done by the homeowner without a final inspection must be disclosed prior to closing.

Dan, thank you for the info on permitting. I just did a quick search on my city's municipal website and learned that they are indeed required for any plumbing work.

Homeowners are generally allowed to do "small projects" and not required to pull a permit. If you use the Chris Coffee kit, everything is removable after the face as the connection to the system is off the cold faucet connection. The routing might be a pain, but it's worth it and JG fittings are nearly impossible to mess up.

If you're going with a plumbed-out machine as well, make sure you drill a large enough hole in the countertop for both water and drain lines.

I plumbed mine myself, but it have a fair amount of experience. The biggest issue for me was access to the drain. That is what limited the location. The water pressure will follow the line as needed. It can go up or down and around things. The drain is just gravity and you don't want any "dips" in the line to collect water and make the line heavier.

I spent more time routing the drain than the pressure line.
Good luck. I love having a plumbed in system by the way.

I've got an Andreja Premium with the direct kit, and an inline commercial softener/filtration system. All connected with John Guest fittings.

It's actually quite easy to install, once you've done it initially. However, I have ALWAYS been paranoid about leaks... Since I'm renting, even a small leak could turn into a catastrophically expensive event if I were to leave on vacation, or just leave for the morning. This caused me enough mental stress that I purchased a flood stop sensor system from Plumbing Supply:

http://www.plumbingsupply.com/floodstop ... ucets.html

This system uses a sensor strip underneath the sink and, when moisture is detected, shuts off the water supply at the source.

But in general, just be smart and use teflon tape on metal threads, test each connection and thoroughly inspect for drips/leaks.

Also, some machines require a pressure regulator and some don't. If your machine uses a vibratory pump, you will likely need a pressure regulator to prevent possible damage to the pump. If you have a machine with a rotary pump, I don't think you need a pressure regulator unless you're in a very odd situation (high rise condo) where the pressure might be extremely high.

I'll also mention that it's difficult to source trim parts to make the install look "clean" if you have to go "through the sink" like I did. I've actually converted a dishwasher air gap as my pass-through for the braided inlet line. Of course, if I wasn't renting and budget wasn't a problem, I would create my own espresso basin, with 3/8" NPT hook-ups in the back.

A pressure regulator is a very small sum compared to the cost of the plumber and is well worth it, almost no hassle to install esp. w/ John Guest fittings. If there is a code, I'm not sure the John Guest fittings are up to it. The whole project is very simple, I did my own myself. The plumbed in consists of 2 parts, the water intake, what you definitely want, and the drain. This latter may not be so desirable and was too much for me to do alone. I remove my drainage tray to clean every several days when it fills and the removal is no hassle compared to cleaning it. The used water/coffee drippings go to my house plants. The installation should be by the sink, this is almost a no-brainer, otherwise pipes in inopportune places. And speaking about wood, Dave Stephens aka cannonfodder does great custom work for pf handles, knobs etc. although he currently is recuperating.

Marvin

HB wrote:There's nothing peculiar about an espresso machine hookup compared to the various kitchen and bathroom appliances, so any licensed plumber should know how to do the work. How close the nearest water supply and drain are to your desired espresso machine location will have a big impact on the price they quote.

The plumber I hired to run an ABS drain line in the wall 10' to my kitchen sink drain quoted code that 1/4" of slope per 12" run was all that was necessary for good drainage. Jim, at 1st Line where I bought my T1, insisted that 1" slope per 12" run was the minimum for espresso drains to drain properly due to the mixture of coffee grinds with water. Since I easily had 10" of drop between the hole in the counter and the sink drain, it wasn't an issue. But the plumber would've continued with a code slope of 1/4" if I hadn't caught it and insisted on the steeper drop.

My advice, having just gone through this just a few months ago, is wait until you have all your gear before getting bids from a plumber. My plumber insisted I drill whatever holes were needed in countertop materiel. I'd downloaded the T1 manual so knew what size drain line was needed. Fortunately, I oversized the pipe and the hole in the counter. When T1 arrived, there were TWO drain lines coming from the bottom of the machine instead of just one. Jim later advised that it was a change they made 2 years ago. The manual I'd downloaded hadn't been updated. Since you say you're not handy, safest bet is to have everything there and ready to install. Make sure that having the machine connected and operational is part of the agreement.

What is the big issue ?
Its a simple plumbing job (easy DIY too !)
Just call a reputable plumber and get a quote !

Well there's the in-line water softener and filter; drilling the countertop; drilling under and through cabinets to get to the water and drain lines; and finishing the countertop so the hoses fit snugly and look good.

Have called four plumbers so far, all with good reputations. I have struck out with all four. After posing my question, one sounded confused. Said it was an unusual request (really? Connecting a coffee machine to a water line?). Said he'd have to come take a look at what I meant. I said never mind and hung up. Another guy sounded like I'd interrupted his day, so I passed on him. Another hasn't returned my call in 24 hours. And the fourth? Crickets on the other end. Then, "Ummm, an expresso (sic) machine? Ummm....."

You might ask a local cafe who they use ? Commercial plumbing companies are much more used to this sort of thing than domestic plumbers.

Probably all the guys you called thought it sounded complicated (it isn't of course) and because they didn't catch on to what is needed straight away, the eyes glazed over and they thought it was too much trouble and they could make more money out of something they are used to. Seems to be the same everywhere - small traders complaining they don't get enough work, then don't return your calls or are just not interested.

Perhaps if you told them it was a dishwasher or a small sink (the basic plumbing requirements can be very similar) they might catch on ! Or, specify exactly what you want installed, and don't mention it is for an espresso machine. You want a pressure regulated mains outlet with a stop valve and non-return valve with a (insert spec) fitting at the end, and a waste pipe at the same location plumbed back into your drainage system.

Actually, the water supply side is very easy - obviously it depends on how close you are to a mains water supply, and where to route the pipework, but the basic plumbing is something even I managed to do, including filter, pressure regulator, backflow preventer, shut off valve, and all in copper piping ('cos I'm old fashioned, and have a probably unjustified prejudice against plastic plumbing which always looks cheap and unprofessional).

As pointed out earlier, the waste water side can be trickier, because it all depends on where the machine is, and where the existing drain points are, and you are reliant on gravity. The gradient is important. You must not have any upward gradients, and the overall "fall" should be between a minimum/maximum rate per metre. I can't offhand remember what the recommendations are, but if it is too little, the debris will drop out of the flow, and if it is too much, the fluid will race away and leave the debris behind.

It is very worthwhile doing as I am sure you already know.