Decent Espresso V1.4 - Page 2

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N6GQ
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#11: Post by N6GQ »

I have a v1.3, and the features in the v1.4 don't make me think I need an upgrade.

The click/clack sounds are there, yes. Two pumps running, and doing all sorts of stuff.

I think price increases are not only for new features, but likely also represent challenging supply chain problems in Asia. DE is also quite picky with respect to quality and therefore they end up sending back production runs of various things that don't meet their quality requirements. This ends up causing shipping delays and potentially price increases in order to seek out higher quality vendors.

I was a skeptic, but I am also a geek. I wanted to have the option to modify and visualize all the various parameters of the experience. I'm getting to the point where I understand the machine and the app, and am getting to the point where I can produce a very high quality shot, and on top of that I can modify parameters to change the shot at my discretion.

Innovation is there beyond anything else in the market, now or in the near future. I'm really surprised other companies haven't tried to do something similar but every new innovation seems to continue to be on the large traditional machines in the form of temperature control, maybe some rudimentary flow control, etc.

Its worth a look. Perhaps you can get together with another DE user and give it a try. Its not for everyone and if you're used to an E61 or other type of boiler machine it will be a different experience, but in the end the output and capability I think speak for themselves...
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cerone

#12: Post by cerone »

John tries to design the machines so that all future upgrades can be applied to the previous gen machines for roughly the same cost difference. The idea is you don't miss out on now features by purchasing now. Pretty cool. I got my DE+ 1.3 about a month ago and it's a game changer.

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bhauff

#13: Post by bhauff »

A new firmware was released today with many new changes. It was released for the v1.3 and is coming for v1.0 (me), and v1.1 after a bit more testing. A few of the new features I am excited for are a big improvement on steam power and dryness (higher pressure), improved temp stability, and the catering kit will do a refill when putting the machine to sleep so it is ready to go next time you turn it on.

Another innovative feature is turning off the heaters, allowing for cold brew espresso, or whatever you can dream up where you do not want heat.

All of these software/firmware features have been provided to all machines since day one. Software features come out frequently, and it is one the things I love about my machine. It is not stuck in time, it evolves.
Enjoying the adventure is as rewarding as the destination.

Jeff

#14: Post by Jeff »

Not (yet) having one of these in hand and the second of the two, linked photos being the same as the first, is the change to the tablet holder more than cosmetic?

For a home user that pulls a few shots at a time, is the upgraded power supply likely to provide significant benefit? My gut feeling is that with a low-water warning I'm unlikely to run out of water, especially without E61 cooling flushes being needed if my grind/pack/pull timing is slow.

Has anyone looked into if the v1.3 power supply could be upgraded from what I the Decent "all items" list shows as a Mean Well LPV-35-24 to what I am guessing will be a Mean Well LPV-60-24? (I have crimp tooling for most of the common terminal types and can obtain contacts and bodies.) (Edit: I'm guessing at least a firmware toggle would be needed to change the behavior.)

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N6GQ
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#15: Post by N6GQ » replying to Jeff »

I think there's been some complaints about how the tablet holder worked and hence the change. Its cosmetic and functional, I think.

The power supply likely won't do anything for you unless you have an outboard tank filler like the DE model - that will supposedly allow that to run when the machine is doing other things (like heating or making espresso). It also supposedly charges the tablet when the machine is off too.

I don't know if its an easy swap (power supplies) as apparently the landscape inside is quite tight, and it sounds like its a minimal improvement in functionality too unless one of those corner cases fits your case. The 1.4 machines are a number of months away so this is probably largely just guesses on our part til then.
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pwginn

#16: Post by pwginn »

TigerStripes wrote:The price increases are pushing the decent out of the price range of something I would ever consider buying. It's a shame. Would love to see them release a pared down, "decent mini" with no steam capability, at a lower price point.
This is precisely what I've been wanting from somebody for years now. If Decent made a model with all the features for making espresso with none of the steam, it would be an instant buy for me. Imagine the V1.3 with the removable tablet in an even smaller form factor. It would be perfect. I have no desire for milk streaming at all. I have a Profitec Pro 300 and don't even bother turning the steam boiler on.

chapelizod
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#17: Post by chapelizod »

I don't see how removing steam functions from the decent would appreciably lower the cost. So much of their tech, software and R&d is about espresso brewing. It's not like it's a dual boiler machine that could have half the machine lopped off.

LATrapp
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#18: Post by LATrapp »

pwginn wrote:This is precisely what I've been wanting from somebody for years now. If Decent made a model with all the features for making espresso with none of the steam, it would be an instant buy for me. Imagine the V1.3 with the removable tablet in an even smaller form factor. It would be perfect. I have no desire for milk streaming at all. I have a Profitec Pro 300 and don't even bother turning the steam boiler on.
yes, I think this has been addressed before. There are so many shared parts between the steam and brew that lopping off the steam would lead to almost no savings in cost or size.

gunda

#19: Post by gunda »

pwginn wrote:This is precisely what I've been wanting from somebody for years now. If Decent made a model with all the features for making espresso with none of the steam, it would be an instant buy for me. Imagine the V1.3 with the removable tablet in an even smaller form factor. It would be perfect. I have no desire for milk streaming at all. I have a Profitec Pro 300 and don't even bother turning the steam boiler on.
The base model is currently the DE1+ which indicates that there was going to be a cheaper, cut-down DE1. John gave up on this idea a long time ago, and I recall him saying somewhere that he did so because he couldn't find a way to make a machine any better than the BDB at or around its price point. I think if I was starting out from scratch again now and facing the price of the V1.4, knowing what I now know, I'd probably get a BDB. In fact, I just gave my brother one. I'm over E61.

Sales for the 1.3 seem to be booming at the moment and Decent is expanding as fast as they can to keep up with demand. So the price hikes don't seem to be putting people off. But if the price keeps going up the way it has been with these new versions, then at some point its going to limit demand. I agree that it's a pity that they can't broaden the machines appeal by offering a lower priced machine, although I suspect that UL certification would complicate that. I doubt that removing steam is going to save much and would complicate matters, esp with the new group head controller. I can't see it being a big seller, and there would be substantial development and certification costs. If they ever decide to go back to the idea of a lower priced machine I doubt that this would be the way to do it.

I rarely steam either, but sooner or later a visitor wants a latte.

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N6GQ
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#20: Post by N6GQ »

While I understand that some folks don't want/need steam, from DE's perspective I don't imagine there's enough of a market to make a change like that. Since there are no discrete steam boilers in the DE, there's no savings in room. There might be a slight savings in enclosure size I imagine it is very small (tubing size basically) since everything is integrated together. From a software perspective there's no benefit to removing steam capability. So I'd guess it would cost MORE to build a machine without steam due to re-engineering and retooling. Personally I wouldn't pay more for a steamless machine although if the machine could be made 1/3 the size it would be fun to think about, but I doubt pulling steam only would make that much of a space savings...just my own personal observations, take them for what they're worth.
LMWDP #614