2018 Profitec Pro 500 now comes with PID.

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ben8jam

Postby ben8jam » Dec 29, 2017, 7:53 pm

What is everyone's thoughts on whether or not a Pro 500 HX is worth having a PID or not? It sounds like they ditched the pressurestat and now it's all temp based. Price is up $200 to go along with it. Does it seem worth the extra price bump or is it just making life imaginarily easier for the espresso user who doesn't know how relatively stable the HX system already is?

A mere $900 difference to step up to the Pro 700 and get two boilers. Is there any benefit to staying with the 500 at this point?

Headala

Postby Headala » Dec 29, 2017, 9:57 pm

IMHO the temp stability of both a PID and a DB is wasted on an e61 group.

E61 works perfectly fine with an HX and pressurestat. If it was me, I would look for a close out pressure stat HX model for cheap and put the extra $ toward an nicer grinder.

icantroast

Postby icantroast » Dec 29, 2017, 10:45 pm

Sucks that they raised the price; imo it was at a great price point and that probably swayed a lot of people to purchase it. Alan, you're saying you dont think a DB E61 makes sense?

ben8jam

Postby ben8jam » Dec 29, 2017, 11:36 pm

Headala wrote:I would look for a close out pressure stat HX model for cheap and put the extra $ toward an nicer grinder.


That was my plan but I feel everyone thinks for single dosing, there are two options a Sette and Monolith... so probably just stick with my Vario for now.

I like the idea of a PID but it sounds like the pressurestat on the Profitec is commercial grade and fairly stable.

desmodici

Postby desmodici » Dec 30, 2017, 12:45 am

my 2 cents: it's a decision made by Profitec which doesn't necessarily correlate to what's better for you, but almost definitely correlates to what's better for business (and those two are not necessarily aligned)

"Temperature Stable", "PID", "Dual Boilers" are all conceptually good things and are selling points for consumers, but they don't necessarily translate to better espresso or a more user friendly machine.

Though not an entirely fair comparison given lever vs pump, but my L-R (HX, Pressurestat) is miles ahead of my Alex Duetto III in terms of shot quality, usability and consistency

ben8jam wrote:What is everyone's thoughts on whether or not a Pro 500 HX is worth having a PID or not? It sounds like they ditched the pressurestat and now it's all temp based. Price is up $200 to go along with it. Does it seem worth the extra price bump or is it just making life imaginarily easier for the espresso user who doesn't know how relatively stable the HX system already is?

A mere $900 difference to step up to the Pro 700 and get two boilers. Is there any benefit to staying with the 500 at this point?

RikC

Postby RikC » Dec 30, 2017, 6:46 am

A PID with a temperature sensor in the HX on a E61 may be less crazy then it sounds. You won't get the temperature control of a db and especially a saturated group design. But it may greatly diminish the need for cooling flushes if it limits the temperature in the steam boiler.

Stanic

Postby Stanic » Dec 30, 2017, 7:16 am

In comparison, the PID won't suffer from potential limescale build-up but the electronics could of course fail
It is easier and more precise to adjust

ben8jam

Postby ben8jam » Dec 30, 2017, 8:03 am

RikC wrote:A PID with a temperature sensor in the HX on a E61 may be less crazy then it sounds. You won't get the temperature control of a db and especially a saturated group design. But it may greatly diminish the need for cooling flushes if it limits the temperature in the steam boiler.


But won't an HX always need cooling flushes because the boiler will still be set to steam temp regardless? I just foresee the boiler temp more stable which might equate to more exact flushes to purge the overheated water.

RikC

Postby RikC » Dec 30, 2017, 11:13 am

@ben8jam,

Ah, I was reasoning the PID temperature probe could be inside the HX measuring the temperature there. Boiler temperature will be sufficiently above the HX temperature to ensure adequate steam I'm reasoning. The HX temperature will always be lower than the boiler because of the termosiphon disipates heat...

ben8jam

Postby ben8jam » Dec 30, 2017, 12:12 pm

It doesn't have a pressurestat anymore, so I'd assume it's measuring steam temp and then using offset to achieve HX temp.