nameisjoey wrote:Glad to hear you're digging the B&W blends! Yeah I'd say Teodoro's is similar to the traditional but less complex for sure. Full cycle is kinda like the classic with a touch of citrus.

Let me know how you like American Beauty, that's been on my to-buy list for awhile. Another blend on that list is Dragonfly Crema Dolce.

Have you tried Malabar Gold? Caffe Lusso GMC? Counter Culture Hologram or Gradient?

You wanted to know what I thought of the Northbound American Beauty. Second day. First day, went by 17.5g beans (grind finer), 18g as the site recommends is typically too much for my machines on MOST (I say MOST, cuz some need I do go higher), 199°, out about 28-30sec. Was very bland tasting to me and somewhat sour. Today, second day, 201°, 17.4g, 28-30sec. was more of a bitter "bland", instead of a more sour "bland" at 199°. No picking out any real flavors, just the bland sour or bitter. Have to say, am disappointed in the blend. I know taste is so subjective, what I love, someone else will hate, etc. The only way I can find blends I want to keep on rotation or .....NOT is by trying various blends. Yes, I'm going to end up spending money on 'never agains', but that is also how I find the wonderful or very good ones. Since I really look to my ONE 4 shot cappuccino every day, I will probably open the other 12oz. bag I have of Paradise's Neuvo....see how that goes.

Maybe it is me, maybe it is my tastes are evolving. I used to be a dark espresso drinker ONLY. Then it was Medium-Dark, now it tends to be just plain Medium.....maybe depending on the roaster, can go Medium-Dark. Here's the thing. Tried the Paradise Nuevo today, 10 day post roast, had to really make my grinder coarser than every other blend I have tried. Then even had to go to only 16.8 grams of beans, 28-30 seconds out. My temp. was 200°. I'm getting very ashy, bitterness. Tomorrow I will lower it to 199°, see if that helps. Plus the beans have an oily glistening on them--not an oil slick like I've seen on some darker roasts, but some glistening. Not happy about that cuz I specifically asked about oil on the beans with the roaster. Oh well.

Interesting to read your experience.

I'm kind of like you in that I used to drink dark roasts all the time and then became a mostly medium roast guy who couldn't tolerate darker roasts. More recently I've been trying some of the darker ones and finding a few that I like. The Paradise Nuevo is one of those that I liked so much that I've ordered it about half a dozen times in the last year. I was just thinking the other day how it's time to get that one again.

I don't remember any oil. I didn't think it was really a dark roast despite what the label said. More of a medium/dark.
Can you post a photo?

You didn't mention your ratio. I recall that a shorter pull made a big difference, at least for my grinder/machine combination. I was pulling unheated on the Robot (start at 198°F and finish below 180°F) with a ratio of around 1:1.5.

jpender wrote:Interesting to read your experience.

I'm kind of like you in that I used to drink dark roasts all the time and then became a mostly medium roast guy who couldn't tolerate darker roasts. More recently I've been trying some of the darker ones and finding a few that I like. The Paradise Nuevo is one of those that I liked so much that I've ordered it about half a dozen times in the last year. I was just thinking the other day how it's time to get that one again.

I don't remember any oil. I didn't think it was really a dark roast despite what the label said. More of a medium/dark.
Can you post a photo?
n
You didn't mention your ratio. I recall that a shorter pull made a big difference, at least for my grinder/machine combination. I was pulling unheated o the Robot (start at 198°F and finish below 180°F) with a ratio of around 1:1.5.

I'll post a picture tomorrow. Our Ipad takes crap pictures at night. Maybe I have to play with the Neuvo more as far as temperatures. Maybe even take it down to 198°. I typically don't measure what comes out. When I have it is pretty consistently the same---about 28g-32g

Two things, most people are going to need at least a 2 degree Fahrenheit change to notice a difference in taste (especially with an e61 machine) so I would recommend trying a bracket of shots when dialing in. 197,200,203 and then fine tune (or go further) depending on taste. I recently had a darker roast that was ash until I got down to 188F and then it turned into Creme Brule.

The other thing you may want to try is lowering your ratio to about 1.5 or 1. 7 in the same 30 second time which will mean a finer grind. Cutting the shot short will dramatically reduce extraction of roast and bitter flavours.

I now pull most things with 16-18g in 27-32g out. A better grinder allows you to do this even with light roasts.

chanty 77 wrote:I typically don't measure what comes out. When I have it is pretty consistently the same---about 28g-32g

I'd be lost without a scale under the cup for many coffees. Yesterday I forgot to put the cup there until the last minute and neglected to tare the scale. So I just pulled the shot by the seat of my pants. And it was terrible. Same coffee, grind, everything. Two great shots, one sink shot. YMMV.

I've been doing it this way for probably 25 years with "tweaks" over the last years. I first figure out how many grams of beans will work for the particular roast. I actually start timing from the first drip of espresso. If it doesn't start to drip out before or by at least 11 seconds, will be too bitter (best between 6-10 seconds to first drip). If first drip is 3 seconds or less, total sour dump shot. Then once the first drip starts I time it so the shot is anywhere between 25-35 seconds (depending on how fast it runs). Someone told me of this method years ago, and it has always worked for me.

PIXIllate wrote:Two things, most people are going to need at least a 2 degree Fahrenheit change to notice a difference in taste (especially with an e61 machine) so I would recommend trying a bracket of shots when dialing in. 197,200,203 and then fine tune (or go further) depending on taste. I recently had a darker roast that was ash until I got down to 188F and then it turned into Creme Brule.

The other thing you may want to try is lowering your ratio to about 1.5 or 1. 7 in the same 30 second time which will mean a finer grind. Cutting the shot short will dramatically reduce extraction of roast and bitter flavours.

I now pull most things with 16-18g in 27-32g out. A better grinder allows you to do this even with light roasts.

Thanks. I think today I will try putting the temp. down from 200° to 198°. I'm reading up more on the ratios. I think I do it in a "round about" way. I watch from first drip, to how fast/slow it is coming out to the color, then stop my flow. If too slow to first drip (after 11 seconds or more, it will be a bitter drink, must then either lower the grams in the portafilter or make the grind coarser), if too fast (4 seconds or less), have to either add grams or tighten grind. When I have weighed the output, it typically was around 24-32grams of liquid following my method.

chanty 77 wrote:I've been doing it this way for probably 25 years with "tweaks" over the last years. I first figure out how many grams of beans will work for the particular roast. I actually start timing from the first drip of espresso. If it doesn't start to drip out before or by at least 11 seconds, will be too bitter (best between 6-10 seconds to first drip). If first drip is 3 seconds or less, total sour dump shot. Then once the first drip starts I time it so the shot is anywhere between 25-35 seconds (depending on how fast it runs).

How do you decide that the shot is done?

chanty 77 wrote:Someone told me of this method years ago, and it has always worked for me.

Until now. :-)

jpender wrote:How do you decide that the shot is done?




Until now. :-)

It really does work for me most of the time. You do agree that not every espresso blend/roast is going to be something that you love or even like, all the time, agree? There are constant varying of opinions on the subjectivity of beans, some love, some hate & everything in between. I weighed my first double shot today & it is 31.1 grams out. Stopping it a little longer the last month at 30 seconds instead of 25-28 seconds.
Tried to take a picture of the beans. Our iPad doesn't do the best at night or very overcast days which is what it has been. Plus I can't figure out how to attach a picture. It's a jpg file. Sorry. Beans are not very oily, but a little.