Espresso Vivace parameters?

Discuss flavors, brew temperatures, blending, and cupping notes.
F1

#1: Post by F1 »

Trying this for the first time. Using an E61 double boiler and Niche grinder. I am doing 18g in an HQ double basket in a bottomless portafilter. Waited 10 days post roast as it sees in the bag, but the extractions were extremely bubbly(I live at 6000') and very, very bitter. I tried extracting at 1:1, 1:5, 1:2 ratios. As the ratios increased so did the bitterness, but that's not to say the lower ratios were not bitter. The lower temps(less than 200F) reduced a bit the bitterness, but not by much.

jasongcasale

#2: Post by jasongcasale »

Vivace is best at 203.5 degrees.
I like 25 grams in and 25 to 30 grams out.
Tight ristretto.
Lower your pump pressure to 7 or 8 bars set against a blind basket.
I have had Dolce on a 2 group e61 with no issues.
I dialed in temp and pump pressure and the correct grams of coffee and have always had good results.
I know David likes 18 grams however their shop shots are smaller than mine I like more volume so I use more coffee still 1 to 1 in and out.
30 to 35 second extractions.
You need slower extractions on the border of being over extracted or 2 slow.
Good luck..

F1 (original poster)

#3: Post by F1 (original poster) »

Tried today a finer grind to get the extraction in 30 to 35 secs. at 203F. Brew pressure was already set at 8bar. 18g in and tried 18g out, 20g out and 22g out. It was the worst so far. It was like drinking gasoline. I had to drink a glass of cold milk to get the flavor out.

jasongcasale

#4: Post by jasongcasale »

sorry friend sorry it is not working out for you..
It works for me in those parameters.
Maybe you got a bad batch or something who knows.
Apologies..

rockethead26

#5: Post by rockethead26 »

F1 wrote:Tried today a finer grind to get the extraction in 30 to 35 secs. at 203F. Brew pressure was already set at 8bar. 18g in and tried 18g out, 20g out and 22g out. It was the worst so far. It was like drinking gasoline. I had to drink a glass of cold milk to get the flavor out.
Water boils at 201 degrees at 6000 ft altitude. You can't get 203. I've had a couple of roasts that I just couldn't make work where I live at 7000 ft that preferred 203 degrees. I had to give up on them. I can only get to 199 degrees.

pizzaman383
Supporter ♡

#6: Post by pizzaman383 »

jasongcasale wrote:Vivace is best at 203.5 degrees.
I like 25 grams in and 25 to 30 grams out.
Tight ristretto.
Lower your pump pressure to 7 or 8 bars set against a blind basket.
I have had Dolce on a 2 group e61 with no issues.
I dialed in temp and pump pressure and the correct grams of coffee and have always had good results.
I know David likes 18 grams however their shop shots are smaller than mine I like more volume so I use more coffee still 1 to 1 in and out.
30 to 35 second extractions.
You need slower extractions on the border of being over extracted or 2 slow.
Good luck..
What filter basket do you use?
Curtis
LMWDP #551
“Taste every shot before adding milk!”

jasongcasale

#7: Post by jasongcasale »

I like La Marzocco triple baskets.
If the altitude is a problem it may not work I ran into issues in Denver with that as well.

dparrish
Supporter ♡

#8: Post by dparrish »

Is this Dolce or Vita? Vita has a bit more bite, as it is intended for milk drinks, although when I brew 20g 1:1 at 202-203 it's plenty sweet, thick, and luscious alone. If water boils at a much lower temp where you live, I would try lowering your brewing temp greatly. You could also try sticking the beans in your fridge for a few days (EV says you can store them for several weeks this way, and it works) and this will help to accentuate the sweetness. I am a regular subscriber to their coffee (one of my top favorites, and largely for the caramel, winey, thick sweetness), and have noticed an occasional batch which needs a few more days (usually I start pulling around day 5, but sometimes wait until day 7-8) to tame the winey/acidic note.

F1 (original poster)

#9: Post by F1 (original poster) » replying to dparrish »

It was dolce. Water does boil at around 201 where I live, but that doesnt mean I cant extract at 203. The basket with coffee is pretty much a sealed compartment which means that is not affected by altitude immediately after I start running the pump. It is affected outside the basket as the coffee exits and as a result I get a gassier looking extraction. I waited 10 days before I opened the bag since it was written like that on the bag.