Espresso Vivace Dolce bust

#1: Post by **lmolter** » September 7th, 2020, 12:10 pm

I had high hopes for this blend considering the number of accolades on this forum. Alas, for me it was a bust. Having a lever-operated machine I think is part of my failures with these beans. And I'm not even going to go near discussing my less-than-top-of-the-line-non-Tesla grinder.

<disclaimers>
I only pull for milk drinks.
I did not monitor or attempt to adjust the brewhead temperature other than trying a couple of flushes first.
</>

I've tried fine grind, coarse grind, higher dose, lesser dose, shorter preinfusion, longer preinfusion (all with a 30-second flow rate). The end-result is weak taste. Not bitter, not burnt. Just weak. I just finished a bag of Peet's Espresso Forte, and I guess I used that as the standard.

Just saying.

#2: Post by **mgwolf** » September 7th, 2020, 6:32 pm

I'm drinking Dolce now from a fairly recent delivery and "weak" is not a word that comes to mind with that coffee. It's a medium-dark roast and very full-bodied when I've done it. Also has a very full body on my Cremina which is reasonably equivalent to your Pav. I don't think it's quite as dark-roasted as Peet's Espresso Forte, but to my mind, tastes much better. But, to each his own!

#3: Post by **Jeff** » September 7th, 2020, 7:09 pm

lmolter wrote: Not bitter, not burnt.

That suggests that the roast quality was good and likely your extraction technique was as well.

Dark roasts tend to accent the roast flavors over the varietal flavors (commonly fruity or floral), often to exclusion. Many people prefer this "classic" style, especially in milk drinks.

You might want to consider some classic Italian espresso roasts. There is a good thread at The hunt for best Italian roasted coffee beans discussing some of the options. I've had the Cinquestelle in my Amazon cart "save for later" for a long time, based on another_jim's comments in that thread. Josuma Malabar Gold may interest you as well, but it may be too light for your tastes (I would call it a medium-dark roast and it has a good deal of Robusta, like many classic espresso blends).

Edit: I do note that another_jim called the Cinquestelle "roasted medium", so I would try a small amount before ordering more than a bag.

September 7th, 2020, 7:51 pm

and "weak" is not a word that comes to mind with that coffee.

You didn't mention whether or not not you're drinking the shot straight or as a latte or capp. For the milk drinks we like, it's the output of one spout on the dual portafilter with 6oz of steamed milk with a little microfoam. This is my standard. The Dolce was weak in this scenario, not when sipped straight (which I don't do anyway). Dark roasts such as Peet's and <gasp> Starbucks Espresso (ok, I picked up a bag at the grocer's because it was on special and it smelled great, but I will not make this a regular purchase), cut through the milk and impart a wonderful chocolate finish. This is my standard.

#5: Post by **mkane** » September 7th, 2020, 9:28 pm

Medium roasts don't do well with milk as you found out.

September 8th, 2020, 6:51 am

A HA! It's a medium roast? Thought it was dark or medium-dark. Must have misread the description. But, yes, medium roasts fair poorly con leche.

#7: Post by **Jeff** » September 8th, 2020, 9:59 am

Regrettably, there is no consistent definition of "medium", even among better roasters.

Edit: It gets even more murky when the marketing people get to it. I would imagine that "everyone wants medium" in wide swaths of the consumer space.

Quite a generalization that medium roasts fair poorly with milk. Your tastes seem to run to the very dark end of the spectrum. Both are preferences. Peet's was known for roasts that were generally much darker that its local competitors and Starbucks, when they came on the scene. It would surprise me if they have changed significantly.

#8: Post by **Me2** » September 8th, 2020, 12:38 pm

mkane wrote:Medium roasts don't do well with milk as you found out.

100% disagree medium roasts don't work with milk. I pretty much exclusively drink my spro as a cap or latte.

Check out Olympia big truck, dragonfly crema dolce, caffe lusso gmc, ritual ace, Howell alchemy, intelligentsia black car, mother tongue bittersweet, verve sermon, Chromatic gamut, mr espresso tucscan/Neapolitan, boxcar Stella, temple dharma, the list goes on and on. Some of those mentioned are even more of a med light.

@lmolter I agree grinder may be part of the issue, assuming puck prep is solid. However, coffee is organic and if the roaster is at the tail end of a batch, it may have aged to the point it's no bueno. I'd contact vivace and see if they'll send you another bag. If they won't, I'd move onto another roaster.

#9: Post by **Rustic39** » September 8th, 2020, 1:23 pm

Sounds to me from their description that OP had a good pull (balanced), and really needing a darker roast.

#10: Post by **mkane** » September 8th, 2020, 1:30 pm

I should have said a less acidic roast complements coffee with milk. Lighter fruiter roast are best consumed black