In a prior thread, there was a suggestion that one could add flavors to a dull roast that are indistinguishable from the berry flavors that are prized in some specialty coffees. Here's the originating quote:

weebit_nutty wrote:I rolled up my sleeves and ordered myself a mega set of food flavoring concentrate from Lorann, the leading flavoring/scent company. I put a few drops of a berry extract into a small spray bottle and filled it with water and shook it. I pulled a roast of the same exact beans used by my roaster (I know their supplier and buy the exact same lot they bought, according to the supplier). I poured about 4 oz of that roast into a large baking pan and lightly misted them with two shots from spray bottle solution, waited a few minutes and poured the batch back into my small coffee titevac jar.

The end result was a coffee that smelled amazingly similar to the purchased Ethiopian roasts--that subtle, pleasant hint of berry note. I proceeded to brew a PO cup of this faux roast side by side with the "real" roast, using the standard recipe used by the same famous roastery-cafe: 28g/350ml.

Wowsers. The cups were indistinguishable. So... <snip> Why put massive amounts of effort..trial and error into eeking (eaking) out the best in a roast when it is so easy to simply and safely add these notes?

Anyway it was an enlightening experiment and I actually plan to play around with the other flavorings. Pretty amazing stuff.

Flavoring coffee isn't new, of course. Many roasters specifically sell flavored coffees, but these generally use the roasted coffee as a base for its generic flavor and add something obvious like hazelnut. There are also the flavored hot milkshake drinks you can get at mass coffee shops. I've had more subtle flavorings, though. A place that specialized in this when I was living in San Francisco was Philz Coffee. The preparations on their menu board clearly described these enhancements. I remember an Ethiopian light roast that was flavored with mint, for instance. I've also eaten at a fine Middle Eastern restaurant called Petra House in Vancouver, WA, where they serve traditional Turkish coffee. It's flavored with cardamom, and is quite pleasant.

When I make milk drinks at home, I may add flavors like chocolate for the typical mocha. The best of these I've had was at Blue Bottle in the San Francisco Ferry building, where fine chocolate was melted in a steam pitcher and blended in to their excellent coffee. It was reminiscent of my upbringing by Viennese parents, but better than anything they prepared.

Do any of you intentionally flavor your coffees? I'm interested more, perhaps, in Scotty's original experiment, which has the potential for subtle flavoring, no milk added.

Here's another interesting possible direction:

hankua wrote:Following Scotty's line of thinking, it might be a good way to calibrate flavor identification.

I'm glad drgary put a different title on this version of the thread. The title of the previous version was incendiary, perhaps unintentionally. It's a lesson to us all that we need to carefully consider the words we use, especially in thread titles.

While it's technically possible to add chemicals that mimic the flavors found in certain varietals, I'm certain that the specialty roasters from whom most of us buy coffee never do this and probably have never even considered it. Such a practice would go against everything specialty coffee stands for. These companies spend great deal of time and effort to source and roast the best coffee they can, and take a lot of pride in their work. They would never add something to imitate a flavor, much less lie about it by omission.

In my experience, most of the coffee flavors discussed on forums like this are very subtle and hard to describe, let alone mimic. As Jim Schulman has pointed out recently, descriptions such as those found on the new SCAA coffee wheel are very misleading because they describe substances that aren't found in coffee -- like oranges and strawberries. He prefers a lexicon where we can identify flavors as descriptive of the coffee itself -- e.g., "that tastes like a washed Colombian from such-and-such farm." You might be able to add chemicals that taste like oranges or strawberries, but I don't know how you could use additives to mimic a description like that.

I should note that there are a few coffees with unusually strong flavors that we associate with non-coffee substances. For example, many of us have experienced intense blueberry flavor from certain Ethiopian coffees. In my opinion, these flavors are a consequence of dry natural processing -- i.e., they're a product of fermentation, not something inherent in the beans. [EDIT: Another example would be the funky flavors of coffees from Yemen, where some unique processing techniques are used.] Some experts, like James Hoffman, consider these processing flaws.

Peppersass wrote:I should note that there are a few coffees with unusually strong flavors that we associate with non-coffee substances. For example, many of us have experienced intense blueberry flavor from certain Ethiopian coffees. In my opinion, these flavors are a consequence of dry natural processing -- i.e., they're a product of fermentation, not something inherent in the beans.

I've been under the impression that fruit flavors of dry processed coffees -- where the bean is dried surrounded by the cherry -- have fruit and floral flavors enhanced by residues of fruit left on the surface of the bean after the dried fruit is removed. I've also thought that the unwelcome funky flavors come from undesirable fermentation occurring while the fruit is drying. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable can comment on where I may be off here.

Also when you have a coffee picked in full ripeness and wet-processed, you may still have floral and fruit flavors. These may be more subtle but still present and available to be highlighted in the roast. Does the fully ripened bean with cherry integrate flavors throughout before it's processed?

I don't see why adding fruit or floral flavors to the outside of greens couldn't emulate the results of natural processing without unwanted fermentation. TomC recently wrote about roasting naturals gently and encouraging heat transfer between beans with a slow tumble to preserve the sugars on the outside of the bean.

It wouldn't be possible to just add some foreign material to the dried coffee in hopes of getting a consistent flavor (especially a pleasant one) while it's still a dry seed. Roasting would probably create flavors more akin to the common Indonesian method of roasting beans with a big scoop of sugar. But that approach is meant to combat the bitterness of glossy black smoldering roasts and to somewhat cover up the poor quality green they're starting with, not in efforts to add any fruit notes. It's not uncommon for this coffees to be served mixed with condensed milk as well.

As far as dry processing affecting flavors, there's many pioneering farms from Central America who pay close attention to not only the exact time and temp conditions of the fermentation but also the biologics that are used.

Apparently cold fermentation in an oxygen deprived environment also adds very interesting flavors. Sasa Sestic used a Sudan Rume that had " cold carbonic fermentation" ( I think that was the name) to win last years WBC.

Not as relevant, but you mentioned Philz Coffee and flavor additives to their unroasted coffee, but I don't think they do. They have long had a standard beverage prep of making each coffee with a significant amount of manufacturers cream (fattier than whipping cream), and brown sugar and a sprig of mint. Usually, you have to make specific requests for the mint nowadays. When they first became popular, it was standard operating procedure to add the mint without asking. After enough customers complained or dug out the mint leaves, they started making that part an option.

But they still love their super heavy cream and sugar!

drgary wrote:I've been under the impression that fruit flavors of dry processed coffees...have fruit and floral flavors enhanced by residues of fruit left on the surface ...

Both residual dried pulp/mesocarp as well as flavors shape the natural bean's taste.

Timothy Hill, a green buyer and die-hard natural process aficionado who buys coffee on behalf of our longtime friends & partners at Counter Culture Coffee...

{{Tim hill counter culture coffee new york coffee festival 2015 natural process coffee talk interview sprudge
With the natural processing, you're letting the fruit and the nutrients from the skin and the sugars go into the seed through the drying process.}}

Q. So the seed's actually imbued with the qualities of the fruit?

A.Yea, absolutely.

http://sprudge.com/what-is-natural-coff ... 86642.html

I believe each of our palates differ. I am very sensitive to over-fermentation and reject coffees which others gobble up. There is a well-known natural coffee which is very popular. I find unfavorable tastes in cups over which other excellent cuppers swoon.

I have never had any flavored coffee treated in such a way that I have. It's always been a "watermelon smash in the face" kind of experience. Most are so strong it's the only thing I smell.. Toffee! Butterscotch! Vanilla! Your every day grocery bean.

But when done carefully, the results can be quite remarkable. Today I played around more flavors, giving each PO a single spritz onto the the grounds, and I'm still reeling in amazement..

My "recipe" for the mist was simply 4 drops of Lorann flavoring in a small 1oz spray bottle. At this ratio, it definitely adds a nice hint to the coffee without dominating it to the point of obviousness. Subtlety is key. Last Friday, I served some of this "faux" brew to my buddy Omkar, whom I share my brews with everyday, and he enjoyed it just the same as any other day. I usually tell him what roast it but sometimes he asks, but this time I asked him to take a guess. He thought it was my usual ethiopian roast.

TBH, I have bought countless specialty roasts that were rather meh (some very), failing to deliver in the cup. . Having a method at my disposal to add more enjoyment to an otherwise so so roast is great. Though as a coffee hobbyist, I still like being wowed by the real thing, and strive to bring out the best in my home roasts.

So in a good drink, the faux flavors come out just as the real.
Is there a difference in how they appear in a subpar brew? I would imagine the flavors extract/dissolve more easily if they're sprayed on the outside of the beans, and would therefore be more apparent in a worse brew, compared to the real beans.

I found an old thread from 2012 that discussed flavored Kona coffee and my comments below:

yakster wrote:I never enjoyed flavored coffees, and was disappointed to find that the Kauai Coffee Plantation served mostly flavored coffee on their tour.

I do occasionally enjoy putting a slice of ginger in the cup.

It's been quite a while since I've put ginger in my cup, I've been saving it to spice up my steel cut oats lately. (ginger, apple chunks, cardamom, and cinnamon)

max wrote:So in a good drink, the faux flavors come out just as the real.
Is there a difference in how they appear in a subpar brew?

Yeah, I'd say so. In a sub par brew, it's really where the biggest benefit is. I say a good roast is a good base of any kind of twist you want to create, but good is good, so it's not even necessary if you just enjoy the roast as is.

Now, I have a few favorite roasts that I buy for very specific flavor profile I simply have not manage to get out of my own roasts, despite buying the EXACT same lot from the same vendor. So I can only chalk it up to the roastery having the expertise and equipment to bring out flavors I can't. That's why the biggest surprise to me was when I added a hint of blueberry note to it, it tasted identical to a roast that I had been buying for the past couple of years.

But in the case of a subpar roast, it won't hide the defects such as extreme tartness or bitterness. In such cases, I don't think there's much you can do other than to load it with sugar or milk or some sweet flavoring.

But for the subpar roast--one that doesn't necessarily have defects but highly lacking in character, or maybe a brew that has a particular note you're brain is not quite sure what to make of, you can literally revise and revive a brew that would otherwise me kind of meh. The thing is choosing the right flavor. The wrong flavor can still make the coffee overly complex. In a way it's kind of like mixing paint. Just a little bit can really create something new and refreshing. But put in too much or maybe the wrong color and you'll find yourself starting over.

I would imagine the flavors extract/dissolve more easily if they're sprayed on the outside of the beans, and would therefore be more apparent in a worse brew, compared to the real beans.

I don't think it matters. Flavors are flavors, and they they'll get dissolved in the solution just the same regardless of whether they were on the outside of the beans or misted directly the grounds. They aren't going through any processing. The thing about whole beans is that whatever flavors they carry are retained in the burrs after you grind them. If you want, you can add these flavors right after they are ground, and eliminate the possibility of depositing them into the grinder. Still, we're talking very subtle addition here so it's hardly a problem, and a quick flush would do the trick to eliminate old grounds in any case. It is the commercially produced flavored coffees are that they are real problem in this context--they're so overwhelmingly saturated that it really does foul up your grinder. It took about two or three bags of fresh roasted coffee before that stupid vanilla bean flavor went away.. Yes I made the mistake of grinding Jose's coffee in my Forte once.. It was a coffee my aunt liked and she brought it over for us to enjoy