Technivorm Moccamaster descaling

Coffee preparation techniques besides espresso like pourover.
gullygossner

#1: Post by gullygossner »

Citric acid has been my preferred descaling medium for my Silvia and a Moccamaster but I was reading through a manual today and noticed in the descaling section.
Do not use (organic) descaling agents based on citric acid, which results in a permanently unpleasant coffee taste because the citric acid reacts chemically with the copper heating element.
Is there merit to this statement? Have a prominently created a situation of "unpleasant coffee taste" using citric acid?

DamianWarS

#2: Post by DamianWarS »

Citric acid reacts with copper that's why it cleans pennies so well. I don't understand the negative effects of it for an unpleasant taste but there actually is a chemical reaction taking place with the citric acid and the copper oxide (not really the copper itself) copper oxide is like when copper turns green when you use citric acid with copper oxide it not only dissolves the limescale but it will also dissolve the copper oxide.

I don't know how these copper heating elements in the moccamaster build up copper oxide but I would guess the negative imparting of flavours are related to how citric acid reacts with copper oxide. Maybe the copper oxide is not something you want to mess with.

If you still enjoy your coffee I wouldn't worry about what you've done to the machine and maybe just get a different product for future cleaning.

gullygossner

#3: Post by gullygossner »

It's tough for me to know where an off flavor is coming from as I home roast, so taste varies batch to batch. I will look to another descaler from now on but was concerned about imparting a permanent off taste. I am slightly disappointed as citric acid is very effective and inexpensive as well.

Hovi

#4: Post by Hovi »

I believe that they sell their own descaling solution and its relatively affordable. For a brewer like this I think I'd just go ahead an use that to remove any guessing work on weather or not the solution is safe.

Just my opinion.

DamianWarS

#5: Post by DamianWarS »

Try just running water through it (with no coffee) and compare it with water that hasn't gone through the moccamaster. You might have to wait until it cools down for it to be fair but if there's an off taste in the water than that same off taste will be flowing through you coffee.

Case17

#6: Post by Case17 »

DamianWarS wrote:Citric acid reacts with copper that's why it cleans pennies so well. I don't understand the negative effects of it for an unpleasant taste but there actually is a chemical reaction taking place with the citric acid and the copper oxide (not really the copper itself) copper oxide is like when copper turns green when you use citric acid with copper oxide it not only dissolves the limescale but it will also dissolve the copper oxide.

I don't know how these copper heating elements in the moccamaster build up copper oxide but I would guess the negative imparting of flavours are related to how citric acid reacts with copper oxide. Maybe the copper oxide is not something you want to mess with.

If you still enjoy your coffee I wouldn't worry about what you've done to the machine and maybe just get a different product for future cleaning.
The copper oxide reacts with the acid, producing copper citrate and water. Probably the taste is copper citrate... of which the taste is from the copper ion.

mountmustache

#7: Post by mountmustache »

Hovi wrote:I believe that they sell their own descaling solution and its relatively affordable. For a brewer like this I think I'd just go ahead an use that to remove any guessing work on weather or not the solution is safe
On their website, they only sell Urnex Dezcal, which is primarily citric acid...odd

Hovi

#8: Post by Hovi » replying to mountmustache »

Well then you definitely have me stumped. I've only owned my Moccamaster for a few months and haven't had the need to descale yet but this would be something that I would like an answer to before I proceed.

Maybe worth emailing their support line for more information on this topic. I had a few exchanges with them and they seemed to be pretty useful.

mountmustache

#9: Post by mountmustache »

Yeah me too! I've had a technivorm for a few years that gets used when guests are here. I've descaled it twice with dezcal and haven't noticed any off taste, but that could just be my palette :lol: