New Cafec "DEEP27" flower brewer
- baldheadracing
- Team HB
Already sold out in Japan ... reminds me of the 3-cup Chemex.
The "27" is 27 degrees, in contrast to the more common 60 degrees.
From what I can decipher, for one cup, e.g., 15g in, 200g pour. While this 1:35 announcement video shows a typical Japanese roast, another video seems to promote using this dripper for lighter roasts, 85C water, bloom, pause, and then a single center pour for the rest of the water.
The "27" is 27 degrees, in contrast to the more common 60 degrees.
From what I can decipher, for one cup, e.g., 15g in, 200g pour. While this 1:35 announcement video shows a typical Japanese roast, another video seems to promote using this dripper for lighter roasts, 85C water, bloom, pause, and then a single center pour for the rest of the water.
-"Good quality brings happiness as you use it" - Nobuho Miya, Kamasada
- Sal
Interesting, to say the least. But I don't quite understand the logic behind deeper bed of coffee being better brew. Isn't 60 degree V60 with 20g coffee bed deep enough?
I am a home-roaster, not a home-barista...
The video appears to be using a variation of an Osmotic Flow technique, which is unique and seemingly popular in Japan (I know some of Cafec's filters are labeled "Osmotic Flow"). I don't understand what science may be behind this style of brewing, but I would presume this brewer may be designed with that in mind. In my limited understanding, osmotic flow brewing utilizes a narrower column of water flowing through the bed, so a narrower/taller bed might be advantageous.Sal wrote:Interesting, too say the least. But I don't quite understand the logic behind deeper bed of coffee being better better. Isn't 60 degree V60 ,with 20g coffee bed deep enough?
- Sal
Thanks for the explanation. I was not interested in their regular 60 degree flower dripper which looked almost like a copy of Hario V60. But this Deep 27 looks intriguing. Turns out they have had 45 degree dripper called Deep Dripper for a while.
https://cafec-jp.com/products/dripper/
I may have to try both 45 and 27... But that means totally different set of filters for each dripper.
https://cafec-jp.com/products/dripper/
I may have to try both 45 and 27... But that means totally different set of filters for each dripper.

I am a home-roaster, not a home-barista...
The other thing is, if you're going to try osmotic flow brewing, is that I believe you're pretty limited to coffee beans that have a more developed roast. The only time I tried it, I used Necessary Coffee's Dark Roast, which normally has a fair degree of pleasant bitterness, but the cup I got (the one time I tried it) was very heavy and almost syrupy sweet. It was very interesting, but I normally brew light roasts so I never looked into it beyond that.
I would be interested to see what kind of effect the bed on the 27 dripper has on the cup, both for osmotic and "traditional" brewing.
Also interesting to me that the Flower line, according to the link, seems to be favoring bypass when zero-bypass brewing is growing in popularity (the Next Level Pulsar also went on sale this week, for example.)
I would be interested to see what kind of effect the bed on the 27 dripper has on the cup, both for osmotic and "traditional" brewing.
Also interesting to me that the Flower line, according to the link, seems to be favoring bypass when zero-bypass brewing is growing in popularity (the Next Level Pulsar also went on sale this week, for example.)
- Sal
OK, you got my attention now. While I do not like "traditional" dark roast beans well passed the second crack and showing oil surface, I also do not care for "modern" fruit-forward light roasts. What I like is a medium roast without bitterness but a heavy, earthy, syrupy, sweet cup. No acidity is needed in my cup.atikhon wrote:The other thing is, if you're going to try osmotic flow brewing, is that I believe you're pretty limited to coffee beans that have a more developed roast. The only time I tried it, I used Necessary Coffee's Dark Roast, which normally has a fair degree of pleasant bitterness, but the cup I got (the one time I tried it) was very heavy and almost syrupy sweet. It was very interesting, but I normally brew light roasts so I never looked into it beyond that.
I am going to order the DEEP27 to see if it beats the other brewers I have tried.
I am a home-roaster, not a home-barista...
- Sal
Well, I forged ahead and ordered DEEP27 brewer and special Cafec filters. But, but, but, after watching the YouTube Video on the Osmotic Flow technique Tikhon linked. I am a bit skeptical about the science behind this technique. As the name implies, the coffee gets extracted by a narrow column of water by osmotic pressure.
OK, here is the problem. Osmotic pressure gets built across the semi-permeable membrane. The video explains this. And the Cafec website also explains this. But... in the pour-over brewing of the coffee bed, no matter how it is poured, there is no semi-permeable membrane. Osmotic pressure is an extremely important biophysical property of the semi-permeable cell membrane of living cells. But here, roasted coffees have no living cells in them that contain biological molecules of the once-living coffee beans. So, as far as the scientific explanation goes, this osmotic flow technique has nothing to do with the osmotic pressure. My feeling is that the technique is basically based on percolation brewing with a continuous flow of water with lower extraction properties in the cup.
That being said, I am still interested in this technique and the brewer if it can produce a consistent full-body, heavy, syrupy, smooth, sweet cup without acidity from my roasts. I have tried numerous V60 recipes but have mostly given up due to inconsistency and the results in the cup. The AeroPress or DelterPress gives much better results. And lately, Hario Mugen has been my go-to brewer due to its ease of use and consistency.
OK, here is the problem. Osmotic pressure gets built across the semi-permeable membrane. The video explains this. And the Cafec website also explains this. But... in the pour-over brewing of the coffee bed, no matter how it is poured, there is no semi-permeable membrane. Osmotic pressure is an extremely important biophysical property of the semi-permeable cell membrane of living cells. But here, roasted coffees have no living cells in them that contain biological molecules of the once-living coffee beans. So, as far as the scientific explanation goes, this osmotic flow technique has nothing to do with the osmotic pressure. My feeling is that the technique is basically based on percolation brewing with a continuous flow of water with lower extraction properties in the cup.
That being said, I am still interested in this technique and the brewer if it can produce a consistent full-body, heavy, syrupy, smooth, sweet cup without acidity from my roasts. I have tried numerous V60 recipes but have mostly given up due to inconsistency and the results in the cup. The AeroPress or DelterPress gives much better results. And lately, Hario Mugen has been my go-to brewer due to its ease of use and consistency.
I am a home-roaster, not a home-barista...
To be clear, I achieved this with just a V60, but if the new brewer aids to that end, I hope you enjoy it! And yeah, I am skeptical of the science, but it seems that the anecdotal evidence points to this style of brewing producing those kinds of results. I imagine repeatability would be a challenge, and it probably doesn't make an ideally efficient use of your coffee beans, but that cup I had was definitely tasty in a unique way, and it seems popular for a reason.Sal wrote: That being said, I am still interested in this technique and the brewer if it can produce a consistent full-body, heavy, syrupy, smooth, sweet cup without acidity from my roasts. I have tried numerous V60 recipes but have mostly given up due to inconsistency and the results in the cup. The AeroPress or DelterPress gives much better results. And lately, Hario Mugen has been my go-to brewer due to its ease of use and consistency.
- Sal
Yes, I realize that the video you posted was using a regular V60. It commented that 20g in 01 V60 is the minimal amount for the bed to be high enough to do the pour. I will give it a try using the technique on my 01 V60. I think my Takahiro Shizuku swan neck kettle is going to be very useful for this technique. For the most part, I have not used the 01 cone or the Takahiro. I usually use a V60 02 size which gives the best result for a 20g dose with 340ml water I use. However I have had inconsistent results on V60, so I moved on to AP and Delter, and for them, I don't even need a swan neck. Just pour hot water from a regular kettle.
If the technique works on medium-roasted coffee to bring out sweet, syrupy, full-body cups, then I am all in. 20g for 260ml is a lower ratio than what I usually brew, but since I roast my own coffee, not too worried about the amount of coffee used.
BTW, I had to pour a large batch of coffee yesterday. For this, I used a 60g dose in a 03 V60 cone with 1000ml water. I was not too careful about the pouring but used Takahiro. It was not the Osmotic Flow technique, but just a regular pour-over. The result was exceptional. I had the same beans a few days ago using an AP recipe with a 20g dose, but yesterday's larger batch with V60 was much better. I don't know if that had anything to do with the coffee bed depth but just a correlation.
If the technique works on medium-roasted coffee to bring out sweet, syrupy, full-body cups, then I am all in. 20g for 260ml is a lower ratio than what I usually brew, but since I roast my own coffee, not too worried about the amount of coffee used.
BTW, I had to pour a large batch of coffee yesterday. For this, I used a 60g dose in a 03 V60 cone with 1000ml water. I was not too careful about the pouring but used Takahiro. It was not the Osmotic Flow technique, but just a regular pour-over. The result was exceptional. I had the same beans a few days ago using an AP recipe with a 20g dose, but yesterday's larger batch with V60 was much better. I don't know if that had anything to do with the coffee bed depth but just a correlation.
I am a home-roaster, not a home-barista...
What kinds of coffee are you all using? I'm looking for the full body, syrupy goodness. definitely, the old school coffee, coffee. I've been stuck on ethiopians lately, but looking for a great change. Thanks