Thanks Ira)) I understand.
Decent is the great machine I agree but it will never be my choice. "They built what they considered the best answer to the question"
I have different view on things and life))

M997 wrote:Hi Jeff, thanks))
Budget no matter but it doesn't mean I will pay 10 grand for ambitions, only Italian blends with robusta, milk drinks also, Ceado SD ordered, just for hobby and good coffee))

If you're only drinking "Italian blends with robusta," then maybe get a lever machine?

Plenty of options out there, and Flojet BW5000 kits make it easy to setup a machine that would otherwise need to be plumbed in. That's what I did.

Izzo Alex (La San Marco group), Bosco (custom modern lever group), Conti CC101 (Conti group), Lapera DS (replica Brugnetti group) ...

... and then there are levers with reservoirs and pumps if you don't want a separate water jug: Bezzera Strega, Profitec Pro800, Londinium LR24, Salvatore ...

They left out the part where people want it to look like a traditional espresso machine so there is some resistance. Maybe the Duval will make it to market and then there will be a more traditional looking machine with conceptually similar features.

Ira

baldheadracing wrote:If you're only drinking "Italian blends with robusta," then maybe get a lever machine?

Plenty of options out there, and Flojet BW5000 kits make it easy to setup a machine that would otherwise need to be plumbed in. That's what I did.

Izzo Alex (La San Marco group), Bosco (custom modern lever group), Conti CC101 (Conti group), Lapera DS (replica Brugnetti group) ...

... and then there are levers with reservoirs and pumps if you don't want a separate water jug: Bezzera Strega, Profitec Pro800, Londinium LR24, Salvatore ...

Hi, yes, I'm also looking at new Vesuvius Evo Leva and Nurri Leva, they both very sophisticated, top notch , machines, plus Nurri is on edge with outstanding design and advanced functions.

New Faemina from Faema. This is what I think is real thing in design, materials and features.

Faema.com

M997 wrote:Hi, yes, I'm also looking at new Vesuvius Evo Leva and Nurri Leva, they both very sophisticated, top notch , machines, plus Nurri is on edge with outstanding design and advanced functions.

They're both new so I don't feel comfortable mentioning them. I believe that the Nurri doesn't exist yet and the Evo Leva is in very early production; I think with a handful of owners currently.

OTOH, if you are comfortable being an early adopter of Nurri or ACS products, then by all means carry on .

I will point out that while others are working at implementing the feature set of the Decent in more normal looking machines, In the world of software implemented espresso brewing, only Decent seems to be continually improving the software and even making parts of open source so things like user interfaces and skins can be developed in parallel by many people with many different thoughts. I believe he's also the only one that allows automatic over the air updates and the accessibility to beta and possibly even nightly builds if you want to see what's going on in real time and give feedback. Heck, John, the guy who writes the code is here every day telling us what's going on and listening to feedback about what matters to his users. And once you have one, there is a private forum with much more access to where things are going.

Not to say there aren't other really good machines, but software updates from most espresso machine manufacturers seem to be rare and hard to come by.

Ira

I'm still pretty new at this forum but why does, despite the question, the answer always appear to be Decent? 13 out of 27 posts in this topic mention Decent whilst it costs around €5k once shipped across the pond. Talking about 'sweet spot' I'd assume a €1-2k budget (being the middel of the price range) and not one of the most feature rich expensive machines money can buy?

Actually, 5000 is the middle of the price range which goes from a few hundred, Flair and Robot, to somewhere north of $10,000. Speedster, Leva, maybe Slayer and another one or two whose names escape me.

Ira

On that scale Ferrari and Lamborghini are also middle-class .

For me I'd say:
Budget: Aeropress, Cafelat Robot, cheaper QuickMill/Breville/Siemens models
Upper budget: Rancilio Silvia, QuickMill 820, cheaper Lelit models etc.
Middle class/sweetspot: Lelit Mara-X, Rocket Appartamento/Evoluzione, VBM Domobar, Profitec Pro500 etc.
Upper middle class: Lelit Bianca, Rocket R58, ECM Synchronika etc.
Premium: La Marzocco LM, Londinium R24, Decent DE1
Boutique: Slayer, KvdW

The last 3 are more about specific features, design and brand allure. Many users won't even know how to make use/exploit those features.

Anyway, it'll be different to anyone. No real point in discussing, but the Dencent-enclave is noticably in-your-face even after a few days of reading. Not necessarily a bad thing, but too much hype of one particular piece of equipment is just that; 'too much'. Especially if it's out of (the desired) range for 99% of the audience.