Stuck: Izzo Alex Leva or Profitec Pro 800 - Page 3

Recommendations for buyers and upgraders from the site's members.
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IamOiman
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#21: Post by IamOiman »

The 4 Group LSM machine my bar friend uses has the safety mechanism where it will not slam upwards if let go with no portafilter. They actually use that to their advantage in their routine when pulling multiple shots as they can simply quickly pull then release when doing the flush while focusing on another group. It's the only lever I have seen so far that has such a feature and I think it is pretty nifty.
-Ryan
Using a spice grinder violates the Geneva Convention
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belegnole (original poster)
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#22: Post by belegnole (original poster) »

That's a nice sounding safety feature with a side benefit.
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eastpresso
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#23: Post by eastpresso »

I am in a similar situation looking at both machines. They are not available locally and personally I am leaning towards the leva. The shop I've spoken to has recommended the Pro 800 as there seem to be quality issues with the leva.

Questions

I cannot plumb initially but read the leva (like the lsm 85 leva) can be run with an external pump which is also explained in the manual/electrical diagram as well as mentioned in the beginning of the thread over at coffeesnobs. Can anyone confirm this or better is someone using it in this setup? Flojet might be an alternative but not common around here.

The machine will run on 100V and I am trying to figure out how many amps it will draw/which wattage this will provide. There is conflicting data showing 1750 Watts at 120V or 110V which mean different resistance - has anyone actually measured the heating element?

belegnole (original poster)
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#24: Post by belegnole (original poster) »

What I keep seeing for the Leva is 1750 Watts, 110 volts, and 20 amps. What quality issues were you told about?
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def
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#25: Post by def »

eastpresso wrote:I am in a similar situation looking at both machines. They are not available locally and personally I am leaning towards the leva. The shop I've spoken to has recommended the Pro 800 as there seem to be quality issues with the leva.

Questions

I cannot plumb initially but read the leva (like the lsm 85 leva) can be run with an external pump which is also explained in the manual/electrical diagram as well as mentioned in the beginning of the thread over at coffeesnobs. Can anyone confirm this or better is someone using it in this setup? Flojet might be an alternative but not common around here.

The machine will run on 100V and I am trying to figure out how many amps it will draw/which wattage this will provide. There is conflicting data showing 1750 Watts at 120V or 110V which mean different resistance - has anyone actually measured the heating element?
No quality issues with my Alex Leva, but I just got it. I'll check back in 15 years from now if I'm still kickin'.

1750 watts is 1750 watts. If you have less than 120V, then you must run this on a 20A circuit. The user manual says 14.8A at 115V. It has a 20A plug, and you need a 20A circuit. You could try to run this on 15A, but it will probably end up causing you headaches with your circuit breaker needing to be reset constantly. Not worth the headache.

The Leva has an auxiliary electrical three-wire feed that can be connected to an external pump which can be used to pump water from a bottle into the boiler. My advice: don't do this. Keep things simple so that you spend time enjoying espresso, not tinkering around with external pumps. Get the 800 now. It is a great machine. If you end up wanting a different machine later, sell it and buy a different machine.

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eastpresso
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#26: Post by eastpresso »

belegnole wrote:What I keep seeing for the Leva is 1750 Watts, 110 volts, and 20 amps. What quality issues were you told about?
I could not find an Izzo parts list or supplier but the LSM 85 part at cafeparts is listed as 120V 1750 watts

http://www.cafeparts.com/Espresso-Machi ... -105-95-85

There is some info on scratches, pressure gauges not inserted straight, leaks around the boiler neck over at the German site Kaffee Netz on this. Nothing major, I believe but a hassle if you have to sort it out as a vendor.

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eastpresso
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#27: Post by eastpresso »

def wrote:1750 watts is 1750 watts. If you have less than 120V, then you must run this on a 20A circuit. The user manual says 14.8A at 115V. It has a 20A plug, and you need a 20A circuit.
I have a 20 A circuit. Admittedly it's not my area of expertise but with reference to your comments on wattage I suggest you check this. The resistance of the heating element can be derived and doesn't change? Try applying the result to 100V.

def
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#28: Post by def »

I just applied basic power equation: P = I X V which might be incorrect application of this equation when it comes to heating elements. I don't know, but I could try to run my machine on a 15 amp circuit to by itself to see what happens. My setup is 20A shared with the dishwasher which does not run very often. So far no problems.

As far as construction quality concerns, I don't have any for my Leva. No leaks, scratches, or cosmetic issues. The design is very nice, but I like the drip tray on the 800 little more because of the fit and the insert tray is sturdier. Functionally the drip trays are very similar and plumbed in neither leak. The Leva is a little more ridged and probably a little heavier than the 800, but both machines are very well made. The spring force on the Leva is pretty substantial, but it makes good espresso. No problems with portafilter blowoff as reported years ago. I have choked the Leva, and that to me concludes that the portafilters are designed well for this group.

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eastpresso
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#29: Post by eastpresso replying to def »

Thanks for all your input. I do not see an issue with the circuit. It is more of a question what the output of the element is at 100V. 14.8A at 115V translates to 1702 Watts and a resistance of 7.77 Ohm. 120V 1750 Watts translates to 8.22 Ohm resistance, 110V 1750Watts means 6.91 Ohm. A resistor should be constant for this application? If you apply the varying resistances to 100V the output is between 1200~1400 Watts an the current below 15A in each case.

If I got this all wrong feel free to chime in. An actual measurement of the heating element would be great.

As to the choice Pro vs leva. The leva is more compact, I prefer the design and always had an interest in La San Marco machines. External pumps are used on countless numbers of professional machines and are optional for the one group lsm 85 leva and the Izzo Alex leva (as confirmed with the vendor). Your recent posts on temperature variations on the Pro 800 also pushed me a little further towards the leva (same issue with output wattage on the Pro 800 btw). The lsm 85 leva is listed at 110V 2000 Watts so maybe this will be the way to go.

Thanks again.

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