Hi all! New to these forums! A bit of background - Currently using a La Pavoni Professional paired with a Baratza Vario (which I love). My daily habit is a double shot latte in the AM (for me and my partner) and occasionally the same amount after dinner. The biggest downside for me is start-up time in the morning - 20 or more minutes before I can pull my first shot. The other downsides (though this could be attributed to technique) is inconsistencies between shots and creating micro-foam with the frother. **If somebody can give me tips on which brand organic milk makes the best micro-foam - that would be appreciated too!**. Both are hit and miss.

I have about $1500-1600 budgeted for a new machine that will be used in tandem with the LP and have narrowed it down to the Profitec 300 (dual boiler) and the Rocket Appartamento. My main criteria for this purchase:
1. A complete departure from lever machine.
2. Small footprint to fit in my tiny NYC kitchen.
3. Quick start-up (this is a must). I heard good things about the Profitec in this department, not sure about the Rocket :/
4. Good frother.

Some questions:
1. Which would you pick?
2. Would I see a noticeable difference between Dual Boiler and Heat Exchanger?
3. PID vs no PID? I don't think I care - but is this essential?
4. E61 head? Is it all it's cracked up to be? I've been reading some articles but the nuance escapes me....

I can't seem to make up my mind! Help! I will keep my La Pavoni for use on the weekends or on days when time is not an issue. However, if the Profitec/Rocket is vastly superior, I will sell and use the funds to upgrade my grinder (Forte maybe).

I've only had my Profitec Pro 300 for a few days but I've been pulling shots on it every morning (and most nights) so far and I'm absolutely loving it. It's bigger (mostly deeper) than I realized but it still totally fits on my counter and the shots I've been pulling have been good so far! I'm still learning as it's my first real machine but so far I'm super happy. The PID rocks and the integrated shot counter is great too. I'm pairing it with a Vario and for the price I really don't think there's many machines that can match the quality! Would definitely recommend this machine

Here's a picture of my setup!

Awesome! That's a good looking set-up!

A few questions:

I see that you have the hopper for your grinder empty, do you only grind the correct amount of beans per shot?

Do you do any milk based drinks? How is the frother?

Thanks!

The brew group found in the Pro 300 and (some of) its competitors was designed for home use and warms up much, much faster than the E61 group, which was designed for commercial use.

Thus, based on your "must" third criteria, the choice between the Rocket and the Profitec has to be the Pro 300.

As for your questions:

1. Which would you pick?
I wouldn't get either to make a couple lattés quickly morning and evening, but I don't have your first criteria, only the other three - so I have an Elektra Micro Casa a Leva .

As an aside, the obvious choice that you didn't include is the Breville Double Boiler. It isn't clear to me whether you want a machine that offers more powerful steam, or a machine that is easier to froth milk with - depending on one's skill levels, the two are not necessarily the same.

2. Would I see a noticeable difference between Dual Boiler and Heat Exchanger?
Watch the video: Newbie Introduction to Espresso - Heat Exchanger vs. Double Boiler Espresso Machines [video] Note that the group found in the Pro 300 is not available in an HX configuration AFAIK.

3. PID vs no PID? I don't think I care - but is this essential?
A PID can make life easier. It isn't essential, but I sure would want a PID on a machine with the Pro 300's brew group.

4. E61 head? Is it all it's cracked up to be? I've been reading some articles but the nuance escapes me....
It is a classic. The design is also long out of patent protection, and thus is widely available to manufacturers. To many, the distinctive design just says serious espresso machine. The espresso from an E61 also has, as has been described by others, a "punchiness" that is not found on, say, spring lever machines. I've always really enjoyed traditional Italian and chocolate espressos pulled on an E61.

Again, given your criteria, the Pro 300 is a great choice. If you have 20 amp service and are not too concerned with resale, then I'd say to try to get the 20 amp version - it'll get to operating temperatures faster than the 15 amp version.

Good luck!

Thanks for the very good advice @baldheadracing! Appreciate it.

I did look into the Breville DB 920 - and really liked the features. However, it's a Breville! It lacks character! LOL!

I guess it's Profitec 300 for me.

Now if I can find them in stock!

I think you're making a good choice. I've had my Pro 300 for well over a year already and it rocks. I still may upgrade in the future, but I still think it's probably the best deal out there right now. BDB is great too, and of course we're all waiting to see how the DE1 actually stacks up, but for now the Pro 300 is phenomenal value.

The great thing about the BDB is you can buy it at Bed, Bath, and Beyond with a 20% off coupon, and return it no questions asked at any time.

As for the Pro 300, I'm not sure if you can even get the 20 amp model in the US anymore. It appears that you still can in Canada (and you can take advantage of the US$:CAD$ exchange rate). The 20 amp Pro 300 was available in Canada a couple years before the Pro 300 was introduced to the USA - the electrical code in Canada means that almost all kitchens have a 20 amp outlet, unlike the USA. Morala, a long-time espresso retailer here, appears to have stock and it looks like they can ship to the US, but I'd call them first. http://moralatrading.com/collections/es ... so-machine

For a more traditional Italian look, another machine extremely similar spec-wise to the Pro 300 is the Le'lit Diana http://www.1st-line.com/store/pc/Lelit- ... 9p7466.htm (As an aside, the Le'lit Mara E61 HX machine is maybe even smaller than the Rocket Appartamento or the Pro 300. I've played with one and it is astonishingly compact.)

That 20% discount from BB&B seriously got me thinking about the Breville 920xl. Hmmm..... automatic start-up (AMAZING), adjustable pre-infusion/pressure, PID, dual boiler........

baldheadracing wrote:
For a more traditional Italian look, another machine extremely similar spec-wise to the Pro 300 is the Le'lit Diana http://www.1st-line.com/store/pc/Lelit- ... 9p7466.htm (As an aside, the Le'lit Mara E61 HX machine is maybe even smaller than the Rocket Appartamento or the Pro 300. I've played with one and it is astonishingly compact.)

@baldheadracing - thanks for the link info. Afraid to order from Canada due to taxes as it crosses the border. I wish there is a place where I can see this thing in person before I buy in NYC :/

Le'lit Mara - hmmm, didn't even know about this little beauty. Will have to read up on it Thanks!

......... sometimes, the process of buying is more fun than buying itself!

Your tax should be negligible to nothing. Thanks to NAFTA you really aren't charged much on most things ... Camera equipment, for example, is tariff-free. I just bought a Slayer 2 group from the US and wasn't taxed anything additional other than my Ontario HST of 13% (our sales tax here). Could be worth while to look into!

EDIT :: that being said, I don't believe IDC ships Profitec to the US, but another distributor might. Or you can make the 10 hour drive, play with a bunch of machines in-person, decide what's best for you, and run away with a screaming deal because of the $$$.