Nurri Leva S.A. or ACS Vesuvius Evo Leva

Recommendations for buyers and upgraders from the site's members.
astibolt
Posts: 25
Joined: 7 years ago

#1: Post by astibolt »

This question is for anyone who has used both the Nurri Leva and the Evo Leva. I am considering both of these machines as possible replacements for my Salvatore Compact Lever. My primary goals for this upgrade are:

1) direct, precise, control over brew water temperature,
2) direct, precise control over a range of pre-infusion pressures, and
3) a machine with a quicker warmup time.

Both of these machines meet these desires, with the Nurri offering a little bit more. As I understand it, the areas in which the Nurri exceeds both my minimum desires and what the Evo Leva offers are the following:

1) Infusion pressures up to 9 bars (or the ability to flush the group-head) regardless of lever position, and
2) The ability to stop a shot by releasing all remaining pressure in the group-head back through the machine, into the drip tray.

While both of these features are appealing to me, here in the United States, the cost of the Nurri is about 50% more than the cost of the Evo Leva.

Can anyone who has used both of these machines share their opinion as to whether that additional 50% is worth it? I know that "worth it" is entirely subjective and relative, but I am looking for your opinion and why you have come to that opinion. Are there additional features that the Nurri has that I am not taking into account? Is there something about the workflow, functionality, or fit and finish that makes the Nurri worth a 50% larger investment? Thanks in advance for your feedback as I consider this machine upgrade.

Silentsim
Posts: 101
Joined: 5 years ago

#2: Post by Silentsim »

Might worth be waiting for Vostok if you're exploring a higher budget than the Leva.

RueFondary
Posts: 24
Joined: 3 years ago

#3: Post by RueFondary »

It seems that there might also soon be a version of the Vesuvius Evo Leva with all the features of the Vostok (thus with manual pressure release a la Nurri Leva, and with automated pressure release as well -based on time or reaching a set pressure level; a rotary pump; etc.), but in a more compact body.

It's not available yet, but in the recent past ACS has been quite quick to bring prototypes to market.

There are also talks about an upgrade path for existing Evo Leva owners, but it's not clear which features will be added and how this will be done (shipping machines back to Italy for a retrofit is unlikely to be viable, but there are other solutions which might work... time will tell)

As an Evo Leva owner for nearly 18 months, I'd say that my experience has been very good and that I've never felt the need for manual pressure release or for high pre infusion pressures. Manual flushing would lengthen my workflow and make it more complex (I'm sliding a plastic container above the drip tray at the end of each shot, which means there is no water to clean in the drip tray... or just a few drops which are easily absorbed by a kitchen towel).
Check the website in my contact info for ACS Vesuvius Evo Leva (Unofficial) FAQ

NelisB
Posts: 968
Joined: 14 years ago

#4: Post by NelisB »

RueFondary wrote:or for high pre infusion pressures.
I only have lowered PI pressure

Primacog
Posts: 822
Joined: 2 years ago

#5: Post by Primacog »

astibolt wrote:This question is for anyone who has used both the Nurri Leva and the Evo Leva. I am considering both of these machines as possible replacements for my Salvatore Compact Lever. My primary goals for this upgrade are:

1) direct, precise, control over brew water temperature,
2) direct, precise control over a range of pre-infusion pressures, and
3) a machine with a quicker warmup time.

Both of these machines meet these desires, with the Nurri offering a little bit more. As I understand it, the areas in which the Nurri exceeds both my minimum desires and what the Evo Leva offers are the following:

1) Infusion pressures up to 9 bars (or the ability to flush the group-head) regardless of lever position, and
2) The ability to stop a shot by releasing all remaining pressure in the group-head back through the machine, into the drip tray.

While both of these features are appealing to me, here in the United States, the cost of the Nurri is about 50% more than the cost of the Evo Leva.

Can anyone who has used both of these machines share their opinion as to whether that additional 50% is worth it? I know that "worth it" is entirely subjective and relative, but I am looking for your opinion and why you have come to that opinion. Are there additional features that the Nurri has that I am not taking into account? Is there something about the workflow, functionality, or fit and finish that makes the Nurri worth a 50% larger investment? Thanks in advance for your feedback as I consider this machine upgrade.
Since the vesuvius evo will apparently be brought up to vostok specs, to me the biggest difference between the two machines apart from the more powerful rotary pump in the nurri, is the very different philosophies behind them. They represent different approaches to provide similar capabilities.

The nurri is for the user who wants the entire experience to be hands on and fully manual. The paddles and upcoming pump control dial put the preinfusion and extraction fully and literally at the user's hands whereby the paddle system is unique to nurri and apparently pending patent. This means that the user can change up or interrupt things at any time.

It is difficult to describe unless you actually use it, but the nurri paddle system gives a direct way to control the entire shot making process in a direct and tactile way that makes it intuitive and for me, makes the while thing just more enjoyable. However the only demerit of this hands oj focus is that iit also means that apart from the pid, there is no ability to program the machine or to provide some automation at all.

For the vostok, the preinfusion pump is programmed ahead of time, while the shot can be programmed to terminate at a preset pressure or time basis (there is also a recessed button in the vostok that can end the shot on command) This will help if one is using the machine on a semi commercial basis or catering for a large gathering or party.

It is really up to the individual user which approach he or she will like more in practice because both machine's differrnt philosopies and control syatems result in very dfferent workflows. For me, I want and enjoy more hands on control over the shot and I don't want or need any automation so the nurri is really perfect for what I am looking for.

The looks of each machine also represent the other big difference between the two. I really like how the nurri leva looks like and the first time I saw rhe white painted version with zebrawood panels on HB, I wanted one for myself as it was the best looking espresso machine I jad ever seen. Naturally YMMV as aesthetics is a personal thing but i think it can be universally acknowledged that the nurri leva is a very visually striking design.

Another difference is whether you are comfortable with maintaining and repairing the machine yourself because the vesuvius is sold direct from manufacturer and is generally not through the dealer model, whereas the nurri is sold through the dealer model.in most countries, though some have bought direct from nurri such as In the USA where no dealer had been appointed for their country yet. (That may have changed by now as Clive Coffee was in talks with nurri to become their distributor in USA so if you want a nurri, best bet is to get in touch with both Clive and Antonio).

With the acs and nurri leva, you are dealing with the cutting edge of lever machines that can deliver most of the abilitors of those ultra machines like the leva x and the idrocompresso at a fraction of the price, so you are already buying a great deal for value regardless which one you choose in the end. It is a matter of preferences and what you are looking for which one you will prefer.

BTW on manual flushing using the paddle, I always use it and it makes my workflow so much easier and more enjoyable. I always disliked the switching plastic container with cup trick as I found it cumbersome and inelegant. I almost always use the paddle to end the shot now that I have the nurri.

On the preinfusion pressure changing ability, I personally haven't played around yet with the pressure beyond the default level. However given that raising the preinfusion pressure represents a large part of the Londinium's claim to able to given a great tasting shot eveh with lighter roasts, the ability to manipulate that variable would theoretically give a lot of scope for experimentation. The ability of the nurri to do the preinfusion pressure up to 9 bar means that there are a lot of experiments you can do indeed! One would be for example to gradually increase the pressure or ramp it up gradually up to the point when the lever is released.

You could even activate the pump and vary its pressure during the extraction eg when the lever has been released. I don't know what effect that will gave good or bad on the taste of the cup but the sky is the limit.
LMWDP #729

DaveC
Posts: 1713
Joined: 17 years ago

#6: Post by DaveC »

RueFondary wrote:It seems that there might also soon be a version of the Vesuvius Evo Leva with all the features of the Vostok (thus with manual pressure release a la Nurri Leva, and with automated pressure release as well -based on time or reaching a set pressure level; a rotary pump; etc.), but in a more compact body.

It's not available yet, but in the recent past ACS has been quite quick to bring prototypes to market.
I'm expecting the first Vesuvius Evo with the above capabilities in a week or two.. If that works out OK, it should come to market very rapidly. I don't know if there will be a Standard and Lux Evo model, or whether they will just upgrade the design?

Paolo has shown me the CAD and it's looking good to me. It's been on the drawing board since last October 2022...I was at the factory working on the vertical strengthening, discussing the pump mounting and pump type. Also testing the automated pressure/timed lever release system software for the Trieste show ....plus other modifications. Then later back in January for the Rimini show and more testing of the 2 group. The software concept was mine, so it was best I tested it...originally it was only going to be a shot timer. I'm the sort of sad person that takes a holiday and ends up working in an Espresso machine factory and exhibition!

As I don't actually have a working Evo, it's about time I got one... especially as people keep asking me technical questions about it's operation.

The Alpha Evo platform died a while ago now because it was thrown together from scrap parts. The internals were so different, and the case missing a bottom and all the strengthening, it hasn't been worth repairing. Although I will probably have a go at some point (once I pick up a spare group heater cartridge)..

meshkaffe
Posts: 94
Joined: 1 year ago

#7: Post by meshkaffe »

I've watched the nurri leva vid a few times and the group flexes.

Is there any lever machine that doesn't do this at all? This would annoy me to no end.

RyanP
Posts: 871
Joined: 8 years ago

#8: Post by RyanP replying to meshkaffe »

I've never used a Nurri but I've used other spring levers. They've all flexed a little when you watch on vid but I can all but guarantee you will not be aware of any flexing when you are actually using the machine.

Primacog
Posts: 822
Joined: 2 years ago

#9: Post by Primacog »

meshkaffe wrote:I've watched the nurri leva vid a few times and the group flexes.

Is there any lever machine that doesn't do this at all? This would annoy me to no end.
I have never noticed any flex or movement in the chassis or the grouphead when I pull down the lever handle of my nurri and o use it every day. So even if there is some movement which I don't know if there is, it doesn't become perceptible to me.

I am a member of the nurri owners Facebook page which has nurri leva owners from around the world, and I have not read of any owner of the machine sharing of any flex either.
LMWDP #729

meshkaffe
Posts: 94
Joined: 1 year ago

#10: Post by meshkaffe »

That is reassuring, thanks gents.