Home espresso setup in Italy

Recommendations for buyers and upgraders from the site's members.
Tylerdurden

#1: Post by Tylerdurden »

Hi, I'm Andrea I'm new here and newbie to coffee at home.
i'm from Italy so before this pandemic for a good espresso I simple go to a bar, but now I'm stuck at home with my Dolcegusto pods.
This is the right opportunity to jump in this world.

So grinder first I found near to me a Mazzer super jolly used by a guy is an enthusiastic before sell other items coffee related. It's an old one maybe 10 years ago.

For the machine I'm thinking something like delonghi dedica.
What do you think? Do you have some advice?

Thanks

Jeff
Team HB

#2: Post by Jeff »

What is your budget?

Do you drink milk drinks?

The Delonghi is a very limited machine and it will be extremely challenging to make quality espresso with it on a regular basis.

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mckolit

#3: Post by mckolit »

That's a good grinder if you decide to get it. Did the person you're buying from buy it new? Depending on how much it was used, you might need to replace the burrs, but that's only if it was under heavy use.
Like mentioned already, that would be a limited espresso machine. I had a delonghi and wanted to upgrade right away. It has a pressurized portafilter, which will give false crema. I think delonghi also does pods, which you might be able to take advantage of for convenience. But as far as getting a machine to replace your cafe espresso, this is not the machine to get.

MNate
Supporter ♡

#4: Post by MNate »

I think many of us would love to be in Italy to scan for classic machines at bargain rates. Do some research and look around and see what you can find. Just know that some machines are much more desirable than others (easier to work on, parts availability, makes better espresso, more info on them, or just people like them). "Is this a good machine and deal?" are fun posts to read and reply to!

Oskuk

#5: Post by Oskuk »

Sure in Italy is plentiful used coffee-bar machines available, but those we tend to think using home -I do not think so. As Andrea said, italians go out to drink they espressos, and in mornings they make moka with a stowetop pot. That is my knowledge.
And even if getting big machines cheap, that is not option as italian kitchens are quite limited in space what I have seen. Of course I do not know Andeas situation at all.

I'd keep a level of first machine likes of Rancilio Silvia or Simonelli Oscar.

ojt

#6: Post by ojt »

Hi, also from Italy. People already said the grinder is good. Go with that.

As for the machine, also agreed that delonghi will be a very short term investment. I would personally look for the lower end Lelit machines, perhaps the Mara X, or you can quite easily find used La Pavonis though they're also quite decently priced as new here in Italy.

Of course the Pavoni is a hobby inside a hobby but that kinda sounds like what you're after :) We also have a very helpful italian user group on Facebook.

As for used machines I have to say it's relatively hard to find used machines, big or small, except for Pavonis and other small levers. Prosumer or home espresso pump machines are quite rare. The commercial machines on the other hand are often given to the bars by the roasters as part of a deal and then circulate back so they're rarely sold as used.
Osku

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slipchuck

#7: Post by slipchuck »

Look for a used la cimbali junior. It's a major brand in Europe so there should be a few for sale


Randy
“There is nobody you can’t learn to like once you’ve heard their story.”

Tylerdurden (original poster)

#8: Post by Tylerdurden (original poster) »

So, thanks to all really I can't reply to each other so I try to reply in one message.

Yes, my kitchen is small so the de longhi is really small to find some spot. Old bar machine is too big and here really used like grinder, but before I'll buy mine I must ask, like mcloit said, but is a good deal.

For the machine, I have a tight budget, but I can wait a good deal. La pavoni europiccola is quite easy to find at 300€ but for bow is too much.
I have an idea sometimes I talk to my colleagues about my hobby and sometimes people give me for free some stuff so I can buy grinder first and find some free machine and after buy a good one.

Jeff
Team HB

#9: Post by Jeff »

If steamed milk is not an essential, I'd consider a Cafelat robot or finding a used The Arrarex Caravel

cskorton

#10: Post by cskorton »

Ciao Andrea e benvenuto a Home-Barista! Di dove vieni in italia? Parlero inglese, perche il mio italiano e cosi cosi.

Most people on this forum are Americans, and if you don't already know, American standards for espresso and Italian standards for espresso are very different. First, the kind of coffee. In America, most people like very light roasts, which are more acidic, and would require very high end equipment to make correctly. In Italy, most people drink darker blends by American third-wave standards. What do you like to drink? Filicori Zecchini, Danesi, or Segrafreddo? Or lighter roasts single orgins?

Doses are also vastly different. Italians drink singles (a 7 gram dose). Americans typically drink 18g - 20g doses (so a triple by your standard). This also effects the type of grinder and machine you should look for.

So, if you are looking only to make a single or double shot (7g - 14g dose), and looking to do so with common Italian blends found at your local bar, equipment doesn't have to be the absolute best.

Do you have a moka? That's a great place to start. The key, however, is the quality of the grinder. A super jolly is a very nice piece of equipment to start with, however, it is very large for small Italian apartments and it has a lot of retention (meaning, if you grind a 14g dose, only 12 grams of fresh coffee come out, for example). If it is for a good price, I would go for it. At 10 years old, I wouldn't want to pay any more than 100 euro for it.

I think you would be better served starting with a manual hand grinder. One of these would work well, both are German companies:
https://www.kinugrinders.com/index.php? ... gauge=none
https://comandantegrinder.com/

If you can't stand the thought of hand grinding, a Mazzer or Fiorenzato will work well. Do you have access to Baratza or Mahlkonig Vario or Sette grinders in Italy? Those are great low end grinders. Or of course, and English made Niche Zero is a favorite around here.

For machines, I love levers. If I were in Italy, I would look for a used La Pavoni Europiccola or Olympia Cremina. My personal favorite, however, would be one of these Ponte Vecchio machines:

https://pontevecchiosrl.it/en/

If you would prefer a pump machine, a used E-61 or low end Lelit machine would work well (Mara, Mara X, Elizabeth, or if you're feeling rich, Bianca). An older VBM Domobar, or Bezzera machine would be nice too. If you are using standard Italian smaller doses of coffee, one of the small levers would work well. If trying larger American size doses, a larger American sized machine will work.

https://espresso.lelit.com/
https://www.vbmespresso.com/en/
https://www.bezzera.it/?lang=en

It all depends on how much money you want to spend. It can get expensive very quick!

In bocca al lupo, e fammi sapere se hai domande!