I would say it's not worth it. You don't know how it was used, how much scale is in the boiler, etc. make sure you check year of manufacturing iron the serial number. I had an experience when the seller was claiming year of manufacturing 10 years less than on the serial number.

For anyone reading this in the future, the test in that Ascasco video is, at least as I understand it, pure marketing, contrived for the Ascaso to "win". It is a 5-minute warmup followed by shots once a minute (20 on, 40 gap). Also, if you watch in full-screen and maybe pause, you can see that the grid lines on that graph are at 5°C intervals.

A roughly 10°C drop within a 20-second shot isn't very impressive, even less so when you consider that the flow rate into the basket is probably higher during a "real" shot than it is with a Scace, especially if they didn't drain it between shots. For shot-to-shot repeatability, "it ain't bad" for a $500 machine, better than the typical Silvia-like machine (without a PID), better than someone walking up to an E61 HX at a random moment without a flush routine. You've got a very steep temperature decline to deal with during the shot, more so than I've "played with" on a machine that has some control over the during-shot temperature profile. Without any experimental testing, I can't say if that is "bad", "good", or "just different".

VoidedTea wrote:I would say it's not worth it. You don't know how it was used, how much scale is in the boiler, etc. make sure you check year of manufacturing iron the serial number. I had an experience when the seller was claiming year of manufacturing 10 years less than on the serial number.

I would definitely ask for the receipt. It actually looks ok from the picutures though, so I believe its from 2017.

coffeeOnTheBrain wrote:I am not affiliated with Ascaso nor this Austrian shop, but the shop surly is affiliated with Ascaso, as they sell Ascaso's machines. For what it is worth I believe in the integrity of their tests.
What am I trying to say, seems like the Ascaso thermoblock with PID is more temperature stable then any e61 and better then some saturated groups.
At least the tests in the video state that:
video

Thanks for the video. I take all reviews with a grain of salt, but these guys seem to be more methodological and thorough than most others I've seen.

Not sure how one concludes this was a "contrived" review based on the shot interval and the chart scale...all normal to me.

Craig, yes, if you watch the video at 29:30 mark, they explain shot duration was 25 sec and the "10C drop" (actually it's more like 4-7C) is when the shot is stopped but PF is still in the group for 15 sec.

baldheadracing wrote: There are lots of people who are fans of the Gaggia - I'm ambivalent. I'd take a Robot in this price range, and heat the milk in a microwave.

FWIW, here's a comparison - the Lelit in the comparison is roughly equal to the Ascaso with 250ml/57mm boiler group.

If I were to buy the Cafelat Robot i would need an good electric kettle or one that works on my induction top aswell, and thats not very cheap. As for the milk, I do not have a microwave available so yeah. This just makes the whole brewing process kinda messy if you know what i mean What about the Rancilio Silvia v2 model? Is it too outdated or could it be a good budget espresso machine?

I've used Silvas in the past at home and found the variability a great frustration. Occasional shots would be very good, close to what I was getting from my E61 HX (this was 10-20 years ago, before affordable dedicated-boiler machines were available). Seemingly, many more were mediocre or close to undrinkable. There was a Silvia at work. I preferred the predictable Peet's coffee from the pick-your-drink, superautomat monolith, as long as it was buried under the milk-like stuff.

When learning the craft of espresso, one of the hardest things is figuring out how changes you make impact the result. The less variability you have in the grinder and machine, the easier it is to associate a flavor change with something you did, rather than "randomness" of the gear. Having appropriate brew pressure, by adjusting and, if needed, adding an OPV is, for me essential. I haven't kept track of which Gaggia machines over the years have an adjustable OPV and which don't. A PID on that class of machine is close to essential for me, as I don't have the patience to temperature surf.

At under US$1,000, my choices would be first and foremost a Cafelat Robot. I find it very forgiving and very reliable at producing very good to excellent espresso. You don't need a thermostatically controlled kettle. You're most likely just to use water right off the boil, or "as long as it takes to grind and/or prep the basket" if you're pulling dark roasts. A plain electric kettle ($30-50 or so) is plenty. Others have reported that one or more variants of the Flair 58 is a good machine. Second, a solid, used E61 HX with a group-head thermometer such as an EricS. Just above the $1,000 mark, you might consider the Quick Mill Silvano or hoping to find a well-maintained Breville Dual Boiler ("BDB") of the current generation (920, I believe).

Some have reported that the mid-range, non-grinder Breville units are a reasonable, budget choice. Espresso machine with fastest warm-up?