Efficiency of one-group espresso machines for pop ups

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wearashirt
Posts: 228
Joined: 9 years ago

#1: Post by wearashirt »

Hello to people passionate about serving customers! My question is organized into Summary, Introduction, and Main Questions. A quick answer to Summary would already be very helpful!

Summary:
Can two people work simultaneously on a single group dual boiler (e.g. R58, GS/3) grinding and brewing, and frothing, for lines as long as 5 drinks long? I'm planning on hiring two people to work in pop-up scenes, with one person grinding and brewing, and the other person frothing milk and pouring. I'm worried that steam power and brew temperature consistency would fail with consecutive drinks in the above-estimated production rate.

(Optional read, introduction):
Long time coffee lover, pop-up cafe restaurant beginner. I have a backyard set-up where my neighbors sit down and relax. I also have pop-up opportunities in colleges where lines get as long as 5 drinks long. For the former, my Breville 870XL (modded grinder) does just fine. For the latter, I am guilty of letting espressi sit for as long as 5 minutes -- this is because I would brew several espressi consecutively, then start frothing milk afterwards. It takes forever, but my customers are forgiving (and unbeknowst to espresso technicality).

Currently, I'm starting to like the pop-up business as opposed to investing my roots in a physical setting -- at least as of this financial moment. I also build extra power in my biceps with all the carrying to-and-fro my ol' car to the brew area where college admins have allowed me to set up. (Doctors, PT's, any warnings against this? LOL.) So I would like to improve efficiency by getting on the prosumer wagon.

MAIN QUESTIONS: (answer any. Thank you!)
1. Will I be wise in buying either a GS/3 or R58, for my pop-up cafe operations?
2. I have a business plan of renting out a space near a med school, where I'd get other food entrepeneurs to jump in so we can pay for rent -- will a 1 group DB still be able to do the job? -- what will I be missing with a 2-3 group machine?
3. Will I depreciate a GS/3 or R58 faster with all the moving around?
4. Is it healthy for GS/3 or R58 to brew consecutive portafilters? What was good about Breville's thermocoil "boiler" was that the machine would load any amount of water into the massive thermocoil, and you're ready to brew right away -- unlike a huge boiler that a GS/3 and R58 has to maintain and deliver en masse. So I also wonder if there are any thermocoil-based dual-boilers out there.*

*but I am dazzled by La Marzocco as I used to be dazzled by the macbook pros pre-2010, so I guess write-it off in the invest-and-forget book, if I do work up the fever to buy it. It's just so damn expensive. D:

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Compass Coffee
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#2: Post by Compass Coffee »

Your biggest issue in any volume beverage setting with a 1 group isn't (primariy) back to back shot capabilities but steaming capacity and speed. GS/3 will be fine in moderate paced commercial, R58 (and any other sub ~3l+ steam boiler) DB (or HX) totally inadequate.
Mike McGinness

wearashirt (original poster)
Posts: 228
Joined: 9 years ago

#3: Post by wearashirt (original poster) »

Thanks Mike. One time I chatted up a barista, and he said they once did 40 drinks straight on a Rocket r58 (they deal Rocket and LM machines here).

sashaman
Posts: 208
Joined: 12 years ago

#4: Post by sashaman »

This kind of setup sounds like it would be better suited to something like an Elektra T1, a commercial HX with a large 5.5 liter boiler. While I tend to poopoo HXes for home use due to the fiddling with the flush routines, for a mid/high volume cafe they are ideal. Here is the home barista review (the A3 is the non-auto equivalent of the T1): Elektra A3 Sixties Espresso Machine Review .

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HB
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#5: Post by HB »

wearashirt wrote:One time I chatted up a barista, and he said they once did 40 drinks straight on a Rocket r58...
I've catered a monthly cars and coffee event at a local dealership using a variety of equipment as part of the site's review process. I typically make around 60 drinks in two hours, maybe a bit more in the winter months. MIke's right about semi-commercial espresso machines having trouble with steam capacity. I intentionally use 8 ounce cups because the wait for steaming 8+ ounces of milk would be too much. You can multi-task while the espresso pours, but you can't do anything but watch the foam level while steaming. Commercial espresso machines like the La Marzocco GS/3 will zip through anything smaller than a "big gulp" latte in 15-20 seconds, less than the time for the espresso pour. Semi-commercial espresso machines will double that time. It may not sound like a lot, but if you have a line of drinks, an extra 20 seconds per drink means adding two minutes of waiting time every 6th drink. Nobody at the event I cater complains because the drinks are good and the price is right (free). Paying customers would not be as patient.
Dan Kehn

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jfrescki
Posts: 625
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#6: Post by jfrescki »

The Elektra is 20amp, if you're going that route you might be better served by the Nuova Simonelli Appia which is 15 amp, and has a lot of area under the group for tall cups.
Write to your Congressman. Even if he can’t read, write to him.
- Will Rogers

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uscfroadie
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#7: Post by uscfroadie replying to jfrescki »

He is in the Philippines with 220v power, so the limitation we 110V users see is not applicable for him.
Merle

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jfrescki
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#8: Post by jfrescki »

Ah, thx.
Write to your Congressman. Even if he can’t read, write to him.
- Will Rogers

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boar_d_laze
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#9: Post by boar_d_laze »

wearashirt wrote:A quick answer to Summary would already be very helpful!
The answer to the question posed in your "Summary" is, "No."

If one person is going to steam while another pulls, you want as much room in front of the machine as possible. Two people, splitting the tasks as you propose, would waste a great deal of time fighting one another to get in front of a single group. In that context, not only would a two-group be better than a single, a full sized two group would be better than a compact.

Whether or not segregating brewing from steaming is the best way to run an espresso service for a pop up is another question. You didn't ask, but it isn't.

GRINDER GRINDER GRINDER

Rich
Drop a nickel in the pot Joe. Takin' it slow. Waiter, waiter, percolator

wearashirt (original poster)
Posts: 228
Joined: 9 years ago

#10: Post by wearashirt (original poster) »

Thanks guys! I'm really looking into the long term value of a 1-group model since it can be moved around, won't suck up too much power, and will allow the team to as close to people as possible (as opposed to parking a truck outside, where it's hot). Then based from your suggestions, I actually WOULD like the GS/3, since it cycles through orders faster, plus, y'know, it's a GS/3. Local LM dealership claims to have already sold 10.

I wonder if consecutive portafliters has ever been an operational consideration among baristas? Again, for the 1-group operation technique.

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