So after researching and reading online, I finally pulled the plug on a Barazta Virtuoso grinder. I have to admit, I must have gotten confused with the Virtuoso Precisio (as they used to share the same name) and was expecting the portaholder to be included.

Portaholder aside, I now see that people in the forums are not as loving on the Virtuoso as an espresso grinder.

Baratza said the Precisio's micro settings allow for refined espresso adjustment when all other aspects are locked in (ie, can change brew times in terms of seconds). Right now I do NOT have a good espresso machine. It is a low end one, that while is able to produce good espresso from Lavazza preground beans, probably will not know the difference between the micro settings. At least this is what I'm led to believe.

Any opinions on this? I am stuck with spending $10 to return the Virtuoso and hoping to come across a refurbed Precisio on Baratza's website as I can't push the price tag upto $300+tax.

I'd also like to be able to brew french press - but seeing that the act of switching grinding settings back and forth can be a real strain on these grinders.

Thanks in advance...

B

So, the answer depends on what you want out of your coffee, and what your future plans are. As the site title says, we strive for exceptional espresso here, and Preciso is typically the minimum we recommend. The virtuoso is a fine brew grinder, but really isn't adjustable enough for dialing in espresso (virtuoso and preciso actually have the same burrs, so adjustability is the only difference).

The good news is, your "not very good" espresso machine almost certainly has a pressurized basket, meaning it does not need or care about the fine level of grind control you need for real espresso. The bad news is, you will never achieve what we call exceptional espresso with that setup.

So, your virtuoso is a nice brew grinder, and is probably plenty adequate for your current espresso machine. If some time in the future you want to upgrade your espresso, you will probably want to get a dedicated espresso grinder, and hold onto that virtuoso for brewing.

Also, don't be scared about switching the grind settings back and forth. Just make sure you're running the motor when you go finer and it'll be fine.

Nate42 wrote: So, your virtuoso is a nice brew grinder, and is probably plenty adequate for your current espresso machine. If some time in the future you want to upgrade your espresso, you will probably want to get a dedicated espresso grinder, and hold onto that virtuoso for brewing.

+ 1
I think you should keep the Virtuoso as it is a good brew grinder and you will still be able to experiment with your current espresso machine and it should work because of its pressurize basket like said above. In the future if you upgrade for a better espresso machine you will certainly have to also upgrade the grinder and i would suggest a Vario as a minimum or there are some nice hand grinder too. In the long term, having two dedicated grinder is very convenient (at least it is for me!).

When I upgraded to a dual boiler machine, I handed down my perfectly serviceable but limited Gaggia New Baby to my college age son, along with a new Virtuoso. He's living alone, so almost never makes more than one at a time, with milk 80% of those times. The Gaggia is great for him, he likes the routine, uses good but not exceptional beans (fresh roasted local stuff found in Whole Foods, etc), he certainly liked the price. For him, the Virtuouso has been a star, perfectly adequate.

And that's the rub. It's adequate. Not great, not horrible. Adequate for his single boiler machine. With the 40 settings, there's one or two that nearly always work for him. He's not trying to find that perfect spot, probably isn't experienced enough to do so if he tried. But he's got a solid routine that works for him and he likes it. I'm sure once he's out of school and develops his palate more, he'll upgrade. He certainly seems to be digging my dual boiler and Vario while at home for Christmas break (back to your 1 bdrm next week, son). But for now, it works.

Thanks for all the replies. I feel better about the purchase. I am going to do just that and keep it as a starting point and when I am able to upgrade to a better espresso machine will reinvest in a better model grinder. The Virtuoso can carry on to make course grinds for other purposes.

When you say run the motor so go finer, should I do so with beans in there? Or running it dry?

And now I've been reading up on pressurized baskets. Is it worth getting a different basket for my Mr Coffee ECMP50? Or am I trying to squeeze water from a rock (literally).

You only need to run the motor while adjusting finer when there are beans in there. When you adjust finer, the burrs move closer together and if they aren't spinning, the coffee in there will gunk up between the burrs and prevent finer grinding.

ben8jam wrote: And now I've been reading up on pressurized baskets. Is it worth getting a different basket for my Mr Coffee ECMP50? Or am I trying to squeeze water from a rock (literally).

Don't waste your time depressurizing your Mr Coffee basket. You'll just make it that much harder to get consistent results. Save it for when you're ready to upgrade machine and grinder.

Also, consider getting a chemex or other pourover setup. That virtuoso is really a quite nice brew grinder, and with the right coffee and a little practice you'll be able to do some great brewing. Great brewed coffee is a way cheaper proposition than great espresso.

You want to run the motor when adjusting finer with or without beans because even if you don't have the hopper loaded there will still be bean fragments between the burrs. Having the motor running while adjusting finer makes sure that you get rid of any particles as you close the gap between the burrs. Without the motor running you can trap particles between the burrs that would normally be ejected causing the burrs to lock up or putting undue pressure on the burrs and the mounts.

My opinion is that while you can certainly spend more and get much better espresso, I don't feel that a Virtuoso is a mistake purchase. Especially if you make other coffee than espresso. Maybe for a while you can put espresso on hold, or just have milk with the shots and pull some simple blends. When you're ready to upgrade later first buy the best grinder you can, then upgrade your machine.

EspressoForge wrote:Maybe for a while you can put espresso on hold

Nate42 wrote:Also, consider getting a chemex or other pourover setup.

Yes. I actually just came back to ask the forum about switch from a drip machine to a chemex or pour-over as an alternate. And reason being, it's the wifes bday this weekend and she really enjoys drip coffee (and americanos now because of me). And thought maybe we could replace her small serving, rather pour quality drip machine with a manual one.

She'll probably scowl at the present, cause it will partially be for me...but... so any quick advice as to which to look into would be helpful. I was just going to start reading about them

Thanks all again!