Hello,

This is my first post here, but I have spent a lot of time reading threads over the past few months.

Until recently, I had only over bought coffee from the supermarket (beans or pre-ground). When I bought beans, I would grind them with my blade grinder (I know... Shameful). I would use my french press 50% of the time and a small, cheap auto-drip machine the other 50%.

I then decided to take things a bit more seriously. I do not have enough money just yet for an espresso machine, but I had enough to get a decent grinder and some new brewing equipment. I bought myself a Mahlkonig Vario grinder (European version of the Baratza Vario), a Hario V60 and Hario kettle, and an aeropress. I also bought some beans online from a place that roasts them and posts them the same day with overnight delivery, so I get the beans within 24 hours of roasting. All very exciting stuff!

I got this stuff a couple weeks ago. My current excitement level? Zero.

I won't even go into the V60 side of things on this post, but it pretty much mirrors my experience with the aeropress anyway, so I'd be saying the same thing twice if I spoke about it.

I don't know what is going wrong here, but my sink is having a lovely time drinking about 10 cups of coffee per day, while I am eventually resorting to a cup a tea so that I can just have something warm to drink.

I have read every article and forum post about aeropress technique and I have watched every youtube video I can find. I have tried everything. I must be the worst home barista there ever was. I have tried ranging the temp from 80C to 95C (176F - 203F), the steep time from 30 seconds to 4 minutes, the dose from 10g to 18g and the grind size from the finest setting on my vario to the coarsest. I have tried variations of these in every combination I can think of using 3 different kinds of coffee bean. So far it's been a complete waste of time, money and coffee.

I couldn't tell whether I was tasting sour or bitter coffee, so I tried to go to each extreme to compare them. I went for 95C water, 4 minute steep time, 10g coffee and the finest setting on my vario. As soon as I'd pressed that into a cup, I quickly rinsed out the aeropress and made a second cup. This time, 80C water, 30 second steep, 16g coffee and the coarsest grind possible. Then I compared the taste side-by-side. Expecting the first to be very sour and the second very bitter. I would then be able to tell from here on out whether my coffee is sour or bitter.

To my shock and horror, both cups tasted the same (which is how all my other cups have tasted until this). I don't know if it's acidity I'm tasting perhaps? It's a bit like the taste of money or a battery I guess. How could I minimise the acidic taste if this is the case?

I don't know where to go from here. I honestly feel like taking all my coffee equipment and throwing out of my window. I'll watch with joy as it falls the 3 stories to the ground below.

I would appreciate ANY help you have to offer. I can't believe I had better tasting coffee using a cheap blade grinder on supermarket coffee.

Thank you very much.

Only change one variable at a time (water temp, grind size, etc). This will help you understand how each aspect affects the end result. Have you tried using the methods shown on this site (http://brewmethods.com/)?

Edit: I would also say that very few people can distinguish bitter vs sour. Many confuse one for the other, don't get hung up on this aspect. In fact there is a phenomenon in the sensory world widely referred to as the sour-bitter confusion that commonly occurs among untrained assessors. This practice appears to be limited to predominantly English-speaking countries such as the United States, Great Britain, and New Zealand.

Do you have a favorite coffee shop that brews coffee with aeropress or v60? If not, try to find one and if you like the coffee, ask the barista for advice. Also, what beans are you currently using and have you tried different beans as well? Tasting for underextraction and overextraction is often not as simple as tasting for sour and bitter.

Like Bkultra says, change as little as you can from one brew to the next. You don't mention what brew ratios you are using?

Eliminate the variables, both brewers will work fine with 10g of coffee (whilst you are experimenting, you may as well brew small to save on wastage, then you can scale up later, when hitting good results). Brew with 163g of water, again you can start playing with ratios when getting better results & fine tuning your preference.

Brew water 95C.

Bloom with 15-20g for 30s in the brewers, add the brew water...

When the V60 is full (163g brew water total), give it a light stir at the surface. How long does the V60 take from start to finish (dry surface of the bed?).

With the V60 grind fine as you can & pour the water in 3 or 4 equal parts, then grind coarse & pour it all in one go...what differences do you perceive? These should force deliberate over & underextraction.

In the Aeropress (non-inverted), once the remaining brew water is in, don't stir, leave it 1:30 with plunger in, then remove plunger, light stir at the surface, & plunge slowly for another 1:30-ish.

Just change the grind, do the 2 back to back, does one brewer favour the grind you are using over the other? Keep notes & report back with details/observations.

Remember, just change the grind.

Also, it's worth dusting off the French press, scale up the brew size accordingly & do a "sanity check" brew with that.

Lots of good info here.

I find the difference of sour/bitter flavors to be a lot more evident in espresso than drip coffee.

What coffee are you using? Is it a blend? Light roast? Dark Roast?

In my opinion, light roasted single origins are best for devices like pourover, aeropress etc. If you are using a darker roast with multiple components, it may be lower acid and have more carbon-ish flavors that are overwhelming everything else. Or if it is a poorly roasted batch that was baked, most of the pleasant flavors may be muted.

Find a local roaster with a good reputation that does aeropress or pourover, order a cup, talk to the baristas, buy a bag if you like it.


I could be completely wrong. But there still is a possibility that it could be beans and not you

Try starting with a medium roast coffee. I had bad luck with a local roaster... Wasted a lot of time trying to make his beans taste good. My worst home roasted batch in a popcorn popper tasted better than his. I think some roasters go too hot and fast and you get a roasty sourness that is impossible to get away from.

Use a decent recipe. Siphon I used 7g coffee per 180ml cup. Chemex I use 15g coffee per 250ml cup. Lots of recipes out there.

Vario is supposed to be a good grinder. Personally, I found my Encore produced much worse coffee than my bunn g1. I am thinking that cheaper grinders may bring out the worst in badly roasted beans... While higher end grinders are more forgiving. I suspect the reason is a reduction in fine particles.

So... Focus on beans. Try chewing one and see how it tastes.