cafeIKE wrote:Other than mental focus, that is impossible to prove. A deep breath prior to dosing could have a more positive effect.

Tamper tapping is akin to grip flexing / knee twitching / rump wiggle often seen on a golf course:
It has absolutely no positive effect on the mechanical interaction between the club face and the ball.

Ditto 'polishing' the puck.

No amount of twitching will make crap coffee on a crap machine brew anything but.
Superfluous gyrations are most assuredly to the detriment of quality coffee brewed on a quality machine.

The quality of espresso anticipated is inversely proportional to tamper gyrations.
It's like Benihana. The show is fun. The food, sub par.

You think so? Have you ever seen the grouphead(s) of a busy bar after a morning rush of no-knockers?

It's not the initial shot we're talking about.. it's about how residual coffee will effect the next shot, and the shot after that, and so on.

Knocking keeps the machine cleaner longer. That's its only purpose. I hate doing it. I really do. But when I can get away with it without sacrificing shot quality, I will.

It has nothing to do with looks.

cafeIKE wrote:Ditto 'polishing' the puck.

I find the face of the tamper stays cleaner when I give it a little twist (very little pressure) before I remove it from the pf basket.

-mike "barry pointed that out once!"

Jasonian wrote:You think so? Have you ever seen the grouphead(s) of a busy bar after a morning rush of no-knockers?

Possibly once, in Italy, if memory serves.

Jasonian wrote:It's not the initial shot we're talking about.. it's about how residual coffee will effect the next shot, and the shot after that, and so on.

Do you wiggle flush with a blind basket after every shot?
If not, there's residual coffee lurking under the shower screen and between the screen and gasket.

Jasonian wrote:Knocking keeps the machine cleaner longer.

Once around with a grouphead brush every few shots will do as much without the dose destroying risk of an errant tap.

We're at HOME Barista. Based on your tapping raison d'etre, doing it at home is strictly 'wanna-be'

mikep wrote:I find the face of the tamper stays cleaner when I give it a little twist (very little pressure) before I remove it from the pf basket.

Wiping the piston with a towel after every tamp keeps it spotless.
No amount of puck polishing will remove oil / ultra-fines buildup.

cafeIKE wrote:Wiping the piston with a towel after every tamp keeps it spotless.
No amount of puck polishing will remove oil / ultra-fines buildup.

To be honest I hadn't even considered the horror of the ultra-fines. I was just trying to keep more of the visible grounds in the basket, rather than the counter where my tamper sits. I will have to consider adding some superfluous gyrations with a towel to my routine.

mikep wrote:To be honest I hadn't even considered the horror of the ultra-fines. I was just trying to keep more of the visible grounds in the basket, rather than the counter where my tamper sits. I will have to consider adding some superfluous gyrations with a towel to my routine.

Make sure you develop a flair in the act.. you know, so it doesn't look like an OCD as much as "part of the routine".

cafeIKE wrote:Other than mental focus, that is impossible to prove. A deep breath prior to dosing could have a more positive effect.

Mental focus will be important in anything you do, especially espresso. I've put beans into the doser, pulled the shot without the PF locked, pulled the shot into the drip-tray, and made quite a few other shot-killing mistakes while brewing the first of the day.
Having a routine makes the first doppio of the day as good as the evening's last.

cafeIKE wrote:Tamper tapping is akin to grip flexing / knee twitching / rump wiggle often seen on a golf course:
It has absolutely no positive effect on the mechanical interaction between the club face and the ball.
Ditto 'polishing' the puck.

Not true. These actions set up the shot. Loosening the hands, settling the feet, focusing the mind-body relationship, shaking off tension, and the repeatability factor all play a part on just how the club face impacts the ball. Or why would nearly every golfer on the face of the planet subscribe to these torments?

cafeIKE wrote:No amount of twitching will make crap coffee on a crap machine brew anything but.
Superfluous gyrations are most assuredly to the detriment of quality coffee brewed on a quality machine.

Could be anything from superstition to actual results. Your opinion is no more or less valid than any of the others expressed without any data to back them up.

cafeIKE wrote:The quality of espresso anticipated is inversely proportional to tamper gyrations.
It's like Benihana. The show is fun. The food, sub par.

Yahbut, the show isn't any worse in a far better restaurant. You've pointed out the situation, but you haven't uncovered the relationship. The food is marginal at Benihana because the cooks go through the 'superfluous gyrations'? Really? So, the food would be better if they just stood there and cooked?
I think that you may have the causal relationship in your analogy a bit skewed. The food is marginal because they have discovered that you can dazzle 'em with bull, so you don't have to pay for the brilliance in the dish. The quality of the end dish has very little to do with the amount of gyrations that the chefs go through.

I'm not sure where I sit on tamper tapping. I'd given it up, and there is a bit of channeling going on under the naked nowadays. I may try taking it up again and see where that gets me.

mikep wrote:To be honest I hadn't even considered the horror of the ultra-fines.

So I can assume the oil and fines build up all day / week / month long.
Must make for quite a 'polish' with that 'sandpaper'

The only way I know to absolutely prevent lifting the surface of the puck with a dirty, sticky tamper is to keep the tamper clean. Or are there PTFE booties for tamper pistons that I missed?

Psyd wrote:The food is marginal because they have discovered that you can dazzle 'em with bull, so you don't have to pay for the brillance in the dish.

Substitute 'espresso' for 'food', 'cup' for 'dish' and you've described about 98/100ths of the shops.

Jasonian

I am sorry about the mocking of your tamping technique, it was merely a joke. I did not think it would start a personal attack on you by others.

anyway I am very intrigued by your pours without using wdt. however, would your method work with a doserless grinder?

BuzzedLightyear wrote:Jasonian

I am sorry about the mocking of your tamping technique, it was merely a joke. I did not think it would start a personal attack on you by others.

anyway I am very intrigued by your pours without using wdt. however, would your method work with a doserless grinder?

<Edit : Removed reference to Jasonian's altruism.>

I had my first espresso almost 40 years ago with an Italian girl friend :

First-a, you grind-a da caffe
Next-a, you fill-a da basket
Next-a, you make-a da room
Next-a, you pull-a da shot

Nothing has changed.

I have a doserless Macap MC4. Grind directly into the basket in the PF with a yogurt cup funnel cut down to about 1¼in. [This is the one benefit derived from trying the WDT for several months.] Gently shake PF side to side to level grounds. Remove funnel. Down dose with curved tool or your crooked finger to 'declump'. Lightly rap PF once or twice VERTICALLY on counter to level the coffee. 5~10# tamp, NO taps, NO twist. Lock PF and IMMEDIATELY start pump. Enjoy. No Charge.