jlhsupport wrote:Rancilio will no longer supply the 3-Hole tip on Silvias beginning with the container that arrived in the US this week.

Who didn't see that one coming?

Why don't they just supply 2 tips? Geez, they supply 2 portafilters on many machines. It's a $700 machine and the tips cost a few bucks. How cheap can they get? Oh wait....what's the tamper made of again?

endo wrote:Oh wait....what's the tamper made of again?

it's probably the same material and same tamper which also given with your $2000 or more priced machine. besides last time I checked even if tips cost a few bucks people had to buy "extras/accessories" for their machines, regardless how much they paid for them. your car came with an extra steering wheel? don't think so

it's quite possible steaming/foaming milk with a 3 hole tip. if some people can but some others can't then it shows there's not a problem with the machine. honestly, I really don't understand some of you people. It's been almost 6 years I'm closely following several coffee sites, forums. You're complaining about a product "we don't want x, we want y, we are sure y will work better" you even go and produce after market "y" product. Then company shows up with y product, this time you complain "x product was better, we don't want this y product, it's not working properly" then the company comes up with a solution and again they are guilty cos they didn't include 2 different tips for free. great! what's next? what if some other people insist for 5 more different tips cos they can't steam/foam with 2 others?

kahvedelisi wrote:your car came with an extra steering wheel? don't think so

No. But it came with a spare tire (although they keep making those cheaper too!)

The status quo serves nobody.

Case in point; My Mini Vivaldi had no drain valve on the steam boiler, I "complained" as did others. This month, a drain valve started mysteriously appeared on all the new models.

People "complained" that the side panels were difficult to remove. Mysteriously again, the side panel were re-designed.

The list goes on and on. Just check the Chris Coffee website and you'll see on the Vivladi a long list of improvements that came from "complaining" customers. (Chris is my hero by the way....he really gets it).

Call it what you like, but customer feedback like this is what keeps the industry moving forward.

Is it hard to figure out what the customer "REALLY" wants? YES. But imagine what our espresso machine choice would look like today without these forums. No PIDs. No double boilers. No Vario. No GS/3. Is this what we would prefer?

Sorry, we can't pick and choose. Either we put it all out there (good and bad suggestions) or we can just stick our heads in the sand and live with our Mazzers, E-61s and plastic tampers.

Okay, I am waiting for my one hole tip to arrive but I have plugged up some of the holes in my tip and I now have swirling action but still I have no microfoam. What gives? I am doing everything people are telling me. I have tried using every kind of milk, I keep the pitcher in the freezer, I have the tip just barely under the milk until it reaches 100 degrees then I sink it until it reaches 140 and nothing. Just steamed milk. And I am getting it to really swirl now which it wasn't doing before. What am I doing wrong. I don't have a video camera so I can't show you, sorry. This is so frustrating!
Susan

cattycontessa wrote:Okay, I am waiting for my one hole tip to arrive but I have plugged up some of the holes in my tip and I now have swirling action but still I have no microfoam.

Hi Susan, what did you used to blocked the holes? Care to share?

kahvedelisi wrote:it's probably the same material and same tamper which also given with your $2000 or more priced machine.
it's quite possible steaming/foaming milk with a 3 hole tip. if some people can but some others can't then it shows there's not a problem with the machine. honestly, I really don't understand some of you people. It's been almost 6 years I'm closely following several coffee sites, forums. You're complaining about a product "we don't want x, we want y, we are sure y will work better" you even go and produce after market "y" product. Then company shows up with y product, this time you complain "x product was better, we don't want this y product, it's not working properly" then the company comes up with a solution and again they are guilty cos they didn't include 2 different tips for free. great! what's next?

Yup, agreed on this one ....Silvia V2 came with one hole tip and people are searching for 3 hole tip...now V3 comes with 3 hole tip but now people are searching for 1 hole tip...

My husband used 20 gauge silver wire. He used a long enough piece to plug both holes with a single length and twisted the ends together inside the tip.
Susan

I used toothpicks. For something more permanent, I used an epoxy stick. Sometimes called "Mighty Putty".

http://www.mightyputty.com/

Endo wrote:The status quo serves nobody....

a tire is given but 2 tires are not. a single and a double basket are given but a triple is not. a single and double portafilter are given but a third one for you to chop and convert to bottomless pf is not. a steam tip is given, a second one is not. those are all called "accessories"

and if we look back at my post carefully I never said anything about customer feedback not being useful, I said "even if you get what you requested, you're still not pleased with it in the end" which is very true. besides in my post I was not talking about badly engineered products. but since you've mentioned about it; non existence of a drain valve or side panels difficult to remove these are all "serious" design and engineering faults which gives an idea about the company. so no offence but at this point I see your last reply as an attempt at stirring and changing my words to your favor so be it, I'm in.. lets discuss those too, improvement lists at chris' site you said? okay, he sells some other brands too, how about checking improvement lists of elektra, rancilio, cimbali, pavoni etc.

you'll find improvements only for silvia and none are serious as some of you frequently complain about. why? because that's what you get for $600, you have to accept it and go on. these brands I listed above they all use as much quality materials as they can. when you have the opportunity please compare the stainless steel quality elektra, cimbali, rancilio use with those quickmill, expobar etc. ask yourself how a double boiler, PID'ed, direct plumb, rotary pump, both boilers insulated, electronic dosage, e61 group, fully stainless steel machine can cost $2300 (if you choose manual one over electronic one then the price tag is $1900) and another HX machine with water tank and vibration pump only can cost $2500 (that's pavoni pub and I'm not even mentioning elektra, cimbali, rancilio prices here)

the improvement lists you're talking about are "a must". do you clearly understand the meaning of it? it means unlike those "improved in time" machines you can get any 1gr elektra, cimbali, rancilio machine to a small coffee shop and start working with it because these machines actually produced for that purpose, not for home enthusiasts. not a single cafe owner in their right mind will purchase a single gr. quickmill vetrano or vibiemme domobar or expobar brewtus or la spaziale mini. These machines are solely for those people who want something more than a silvia or a gaggia classic or a cellini or a nivola but not willing to pay $3500 or $4500 to an elektra or cimbali or rancilio. btw have you checked the background of these companies? ie. cimbali.. they had microcimbali once but now they offer nothing for home users. rancilio came up only with silvia and lucy which are the same machines except one of them has grinder installed on it and rancilio had no intention for it to be a home machine but to meet increasing demands they added "a home line". elektra strictly separates its home line from commercial line and even their lowest offering for home line starts at $999 which is elektra nivola. have you checked when was the last time pavoni made improvements on their europiccola? among all rancilio is the only one who really listens and cares customer requests and I'm telling you that they really don't have to. for $600 range this is max they can, you're getting a stainless steel, commercial grouphead, commercial steam wand, commercial-like heavy portafilter, 3 way valve, brass boiler and over 2 liters water tank, plus small foot-print, please --if you can-- go and design/engineer a machine under $600 including all of these plus bla bla.. maybe the closest to ideals you can get a nuova simonelli oscar for $960 but it's fully abs? eh what you expect for $960. Another question for you, if it's possible to improve without increasing price, then how come a small grinder like vario costs $430? almost all of you waited for years for the ultimate home machine to appear, and when it did it was $7500 how so? since it's impossible for most users to give that much money, you get cheaper duplicates and you call it improvement? lets not plug our ears and close our eyes, and lets not mix apples and pears, these alternative machines are in production only because you guys request them, so they are bound to improve as much as you demand for improvement cos their production not as large as above companies, simply they work for you and just maybe for those who shop for their cafe without any knowledge on the matter. if you still insist about updates and free extra tips then I say you clearly don't have an idea about industrial production and how much a mold change costs, besides why they should change? it's "working" for god's sake! it's just not working for you.

Anyway, back to my previous post, you never made it clear, the tamper's material, yours also was plastic right? and you got 1 tip for your $2000 machine right?

kahvedelisi wrote:among all rancilio is the only one who really listens and cares customer requests and I'm telling you that they really don't have to.

Bad example.

I've owned Rancilio's (machine and grinder). My Siliva had a huge deadband that has been complained about for years (no fix in sight). My Rocky had a huge amount of play (also complained about for years) and no fix. Mine was also defective out of the box....but that's another story.

What we got in the 2009 model was a chrome steam knob and a 3 hole tip that isn't balanced for the boiler (who asked for that?).

With Rancilio, it's like we don't speak the same language....oh wait!

By the way, I wrote directly to LaSpaziale 3 times with questions. They wrote back with an answer (in English) from their engineers each time. Try that with Rancilio.

kahvedelisi wrote:Anyway, back to my previous post, you never made it clear, the tamper's material, yours also was plastic right? and you got 1 tip for your $2000 machine right?

What's your point? They should give me a better tamper and spare tip as well. Instead they gave me two portafilters (that's good), an extra set of brewhead screens (nice too) and a large BBQ brush for cleaning (I would have preferred a tip over the BBQ brush).

yes we're clearly not speaking the same language.. oh thankfully!

anyway which part of this sentence "for $600 range this is max they can" you didn't understand? cos it simply means "for $600 this is the max you get"

would you prefer me to repeat it in academic turkish? "600 dolar'a elde edebileceğinin maksimumu budur" or in turkish slang "600 papel'e anca bu olur" or in french? "money money money"

about writing to rancilio, maybe it was your luck cos last time I wrote to them about my md40 order I received an md50 with apologies cos they wouldn't be able to meet the deadline if they waited for md40 production. yeah they were nice enough to offer md50 same price as md40 you know they didn't have to.

PS. implying about "language".. classy move

Sorry Elif. Don't take offense. I think you mis-read my post. It was a joke about Rancilio, not you or about anybody's language.

Of course I applaud you speaking many languages. I'm bilingual as well and live in a Province where English is the second language.

no offence taken since you added to original post "With Rancilio," part

and I apologize from forum members and readers if my tone was off. how to say.. hmm.. it sometimes happens "in the heat of discussion"

good day to all

ps. susan forget about the thermometer, at this point it's slowing your progress down cos you're watching it. burning some milk won't do any harm, starbucks sells burnt milk everyday, concentrate on your pitcher, milk and tip, you should hear tch tch tch sound, don't raise your pitcher till you're sure you have enough bubbles to swirl later and create microfoam. and when you start raising your pitcher up, do it slowly, just millimeter by millimeter. don't concentrate on perfect microfoam, try different moves, try to achieve some quality foam first, microfoam will come eventually. stay calm. you'll do it.

Update: I received my one hole tip and after the third try I finally made microfoam!! Now I have done it three times in a row. I am so happy and I want to thank everyone for their posts in trying to help me.
Have a great weekend,
Susan

I tested the new steam tip too and its much better .Thanks to cattycontessa!