Hello All,

I'm a novice espresso drinker using a DeLonghi EC155. I have noticed that while my espresso is OK, I am not able to make some of the thicker consistency espresso I desire that other restaurants make (most notably Il Cecconi and Colori Kithen in Los Angeles). These are almost mud-like (the coffee itself, not just the crema).

Can anyone tell me what is the key to making espresso that is not watery like coffee? Is it the machine, the beans, the technique, all of the above?? Colori Kitchen mentioned they use Danesi coffee with a Cimbala machine. Am I completely hopeless trying this with my setup and freshly ground beans from Illy or Lavazza?

Thanks!

Steve

Having no experience with your machine, I can recommend some starting points.

1. Change your coffee. If you buy the bulk coffee's like Lavazza or otherwise, you're doing yourself a disservice as they are rarely fresh (fresh in this instance meaning roasted within 10 days) and you are already losing flavor. Try switching to a micro roaster in your area and getting something that has been roasted within a couple of days. Otherwise look at the Espresso Blends 2010 link on the front page of HB and pick one of those roasters. Online you can have coffee delivered to you within 2 days that has been roasted the day before (or at most 2-3 days before you order).

2. You haven't mentioned what kind of grinder that you're using and I hope that you have a grinder? If not, that is really your problem as if you're buying pre-ground beans, you'll never be able to replicate what you want. If you do have a grinder, go to 3.

3. Fine tune your grind. With your freshly roasted and ground beans, find the point to where you can clog your machine and not produce any espresso or hardly any within the 30sec time frame. Once you have established that point, dial up the grinder to increase the size of the grind until you begin to see flow and you can replicate 1,5oz in 25secs. If you want it thicker once you've established that point, than either a)updose to where you have more than 16-18g in your PF or b)maintain the same grams, but increase the fineness of the grind. You should easily be able to find the point of the 'muddy' espresso that you desire in under a half hour.

Good Luck!

Hello, I've had two of that model and I can assure you that it is the machine first, then your beans. The machine is incapable of producing enough pressure and keeping a stable temperature. You can remove the pressurizer from the portafilter, and coupled with fresh beans that you grind on a quality grinder, can produce occasional very good espresso. However, it will be wildly inconsistent.

Steve,

Welcome to HB.

To try to answer you question I can tell you that your machine is most definitely sub-par. As has already been mentioned, it can't deliver adequate presure or temperature to get the most out of whatever beans are used. Now, speaking of beans, Illy and Lavazza might be "good stuff" to a few folks if ground properly and pulled on a capable machine however, by the standards of nearly everyone on this forum they are old by the time they arrive at the store. Beans used should be 3 - 14 days post roasting. Grinder should be a burr grinder (real one, not the $40 "burr" grinder you buy at Wal-Mart).

An old conical burr hand-grinder (capable of grinding fine enough for espresso) paired with a used La Pavoni and fresh roasted beans is one of the cheapest ways to get what you are looking for. So, if you have about $500 available you're in luck. If you don't have that, start with the hand-mill and fresh beans.

Please post details on your grinder so we can help you tweak what you do have.

Thanks guys! The knowledge here is amazing.

As some background, I started using these 'famous' brands of beans not knowing better. Currently I also use beans from Whole Foods (market here in CA) that roasts beans every couple of days. So I have been grinding my own which leads to other issues.

My grinder is a Capresso 560 (I think I paid about $90 on Amazon), and it says it's a conical burr grinder. It has 16 settings and I'm using the 6th setting overall which is the 2nd setting in the "Fine" category. There are 4 'settings' in 4 groups: Extra Fine, Fine, Medium, Coarse.

Regardless of beans my espresso has always been watery so I was suspecting the machine since it's low-end. But I will play around with the suggestions given already and check back to see what else you say!

Thank you!

Steve,

First of all, let me join in welcoming you to HB. And, sadly, let me also join in the chorus of "your equipment is at fault." It's not only the machine, although that is a major component of the problem. It's also the grinder (IMHO), as well as the coffee.

Now, keep in mind that -- even though some of us have been "crazy" enough to spend several thousands of dollars on equipment -- great espresso can be had at home for much less than that. But in the hundreds-of-dollar arena, the pickings are slim and generally speaking not to be found in places like Williams-Sonoma, Sur La Table, and the Cellar at Macy's.

I'm not a big fan of DeLonghi espresso machines, nor am I a fan of Capresso grinders such as yours. Sorry.

The beans are something we can discuss later.

I would certainly recommend upgrading both your grinder and your machine. As I said, this need not cost thousands, but it certainly will cost hundreds . . .

Some options for machines:

• Le'Lit PL41QE
• Gaggia Classic
• Rancilio Silvia v3
• and, if you're interested in a lever machine, Ponte Vecchio Export

Some options for grinders:

• Baratza Vario
• Cunill Tranquilo
• Le'Lit PL53
• Nemox Lux Plus
• Vanelli's Mini-Pro III

Since I don't know your budget, I have kept all of these on the lower-end of things . . .

It's a place to start.

Cheers,
Jason

Jason,

Appreciate it. I did not want to jump head first into more expensive equipment not knowing what I was doing. Now that I can make a mediocre espresso quite well I will delve into the hundreds of dollars range and see the difference it makes. Thousands of dollars isn't so much a budget issue as a convince-the-wife issue. I only drink a cup a day, however if I had some quality heavy duty machinery I might up that dosage.

Thanks again!

Hi and welcome

Now don't take this the wrong way but use it as a guide in your coffee journey
I want to make a point of wording and this is pretty much a general but accurate observation

If you purchase a machine or grinder from a department store or similar I would class it as a coffee making "Appliance"
some are made better than others
All are limited as to coffee making to consistent coffee quality standard

Next level of machine is a proper boiler machine of which a Silvia would be the best starter machine that will teach you a thing or 2 on making coffee. However it does require user awareness on correct operation to be followed religiously or risk damage

Now to Grinders
I have mentioned this before
A grinder is the most important part of your coffee making kit
A good grinder will make pretty much any machine sing a different tune
I have tamed some stubborn machines with a good grind and tamp

KK

Dont forget that most espresso machines are built to last a very long time when treated good. You will most likely be able to find machines like the Rancilio silvia (and grinders like the Rancilio Rocky) in good shape second hand, for 40-50% of the price.

Another vote for the Rancilio V3. Jason also recommended some great grinders. As for beans- try the Klatch in CA.