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Problem with fast pour times making espresso - Page 2

Postby srevli on Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:40 pm

Thanks to everyone who has replied so far and given their feedback.

I've been using this grinder for about three years or so--but never had a problem until this batch of coffee.

The coffee is not stale; in fact I was there at the roaster's while it was being roasted and bought it right then. So it's as fresh as it gets. That's one of the reasons I was so perplexed. I thought it must be the beans since the problem began with the beans, but I too didn't think such fresh beans would behave in this way.

I'm almost finished with this batch anyway (gave up on using the beans for espresso and have been mostly using them with my French Press). I'm going to buy different beans from a different roaster in a couple of days and see if that solves the problem. If not, then I can look at other possibilities. Fingers crossed!
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Postby srevli on Thu Aug 11, 2011 7:37 pm

Hi everyone. Just thought I would update this thread in case it can be of use to anyone with a similar problem who comes across it.

Turns out it was completely an issue with the beans. I just bought some new beans from a different roaster and there is a night and day difference. Once again I am able to control pour times through making adjustments with my grinder.
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Postby cannonfodder on Fri Aug 12, 2011 12:56 pm

Beans that are too fresh will also gush due to the excess co2 in the beans. They need to rest 2-3 days before use.
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Postby srevli on Fri Aug 12, 2011 3:20 pm

Well, I think there may still be a problem beyond the beans.

With the new beans I now have greater control over my pour times. But something still seems off. The espresso is bitter. And, what concerns me more, the temperature of the water is scalding hot, so that if I take a sip of my espresso I burn my tongue. I don't remember the water temperature ever being this hot before.

I'm wondering if something could be off with my machine, and if the super hot water is part of what is causing the problem.

Any ideas?

Meanwhile I'll keep experimenting...
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Postby boar_d_laze on Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:15 pm

If small changes don't work, make big changes. What's the worst that can happen? You sink two shots in a row? Hey, it's only coffee.

The easiest variables to control are grind, temp, and dose. Coarser/finer; cooler/hotter; underdose/overdose all change the balance between bitter and sour. There is no one "setting" for any of these, let alone all of them in combination. There's no guarantee that any of them will be right from day to day with a given coffee.

You taste, you adjust.

What's going on with your espresso machine temperatures? You'll have to tell me. You haven't said what they were like before, what's changed other than possibly the temps themselves, or anything else which might inform. So let's go with, "?"

In the meantime, lower your brew temperatures by improving your "water dance" technique, taking longer cooling flushes and/or timing them so they're closer to the actual pull. That should push the needle away from bitter somewhat.

If your temps and steam pressure run consistently high, we'll think about other things. Otherwise, manage temps with cooling flushes.

The Gaggia Dose has serious limitations in terms of what it can do, and how consistently it can do it. It never makes it easy to make consistently good coffee even with good beans and a good grind. You may want to think about stepping up to a decent HX.

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Postby srevli on Sun Aug 14, 2011 5:26 pm

Thanks for you reply.

I know the Gaggia Dose is nothing great as espresso machines go, but I've been satisfied enough with the quality of the espresso I have made with it until recently.

I don't know exact temperatures. I can just say that I ended up with a scalded tongue when I went to drink my espresso, which had never happened to me previously. I've always been able to drink my espresso comfortably right after it was done.

The water coming out of my machine now is noticeably much hotter than it has ever been in the past, and this is a recent change. This is the case both for water coming out of the brew head and water from the hot water dispenser. I am thinking this indicates a problem with my machine?

What is a "Cooling flush"? I'm unfamiliar with the terminology. My machine doesn't have any option for cooling that I know of. Is this the same thing as pulling a blank shot, or are you talking about something else entirely?
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Postby allon on Sun Aug 14, 2011 9:17 pm

Have you descaled lately?
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Postby srevli on Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:41 pm

No, I've never descaled. Based on what I read in the manual, I thought that it was only necessary to descale if hard water was being used in the machine. How often should I descale if using purified water? And do I need to purchase Gaggia's descaler as the manual recommends or is there something I might have at home that will work fine as a substitute? Thanks.
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Postby malachi on Mon Aug 15, 2011 4:47 pm

srevli wrote:What is a "Cooling flush"? I'm unfamiliar with the terminology. My machine doesn't have any option for cooling that I know of. Is this the same thing as pulling a blank shot, or are you talking about something else entirely?


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Postby srevli on Wed Aug 17, 2011 5:10 pm

Ok, I think (hope?) I may be closing in on the problem.

I watched a few videos and saw the water coming through the showerscreen of the Gaggia in the form of large droplets of water.

The water that is coming through the shower screen of my Gaggia, however, looks like rain, and a few of the strands of rain are coming down diagonally rather than vertically. So there is water in all directions.

Anyone have any ideas about what might be causing this?

I tried to remove the shower screen with a phillips head which appears to be about the right size but it simply will not budge and I stopped trying lest I should strip the screw. Is something special needed to remove the shower screen properly?
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