jonny wrote:you'll get it. I've never used a Strada so I can't answer directly but I can say commercial machines are just different, and you just have to get a feel for them. Wand placement, angle, aeration, etc. is all slightly different. Once you get yourself dialed into the machine, it will be effortless. In the mean time yes it will probably be frustrating, but hang in there.

Thanks for the encouragement.

I am so grateful. The 42 second video on the GS/3 did more for me than any advice I have ever been given on Latte art in last two years. My La Spaz is a powerful steamer and I've been overdoing it apparently.

I have really been struggling steaming. You are correct, his art is not as intracate as Holly Brown's but his pour is as simple as ABC. Imagine starting at like of cup and not even prepping the surface. I admit I did use the earlier advice about just introduce a tiny amount of air and not immediately sink your wand to the bottom all the way like I've been doing. Just sink a tiny bit, perhaps halfway. Worked much better tonite.

So my wife's latte tonite didn't have a rosetta but, hey. Just wait til I have more practice since eliminating a bottleneck.

She said "that looks like a leaf"! I said, "Yeah, thats a Calla Lily leaf", since she has houseplants all over the house.
"Really"? "Absolutely I just learned that one on HB a few minutes ago".

Thanks again.

Andy, I wanted to share with you a couple o' cups that you might like. Crate and Barrel has a nice 10 ounce cup, a little on the thin side and still a little large, but huge opening. http://www.crateandbarrel.com/dining-an...er/s590536
The other one I like is a 5 ounce cappuccino cup (pretty sure it is strict 5 ounces when I measured) made by Inker. It is the Low Mocca cappuccino. It's like a squashed tulip. It's my widest comp-cap. Not sure how it compares to the intelli cup though. I can measure the exact inside diameter if you are interested though. I got mine from Victrola in Seattle but you can get them plain at Orphan Espresso. http://www.orphanespresso.com/Inker-552..._4050.html

Not sure if this has already been posted, but I thought it was a cool vid (although a tad cheesy). It looks like a Strada, and they basically blast the steam into the milk, while keeping the pitcher entirely still--no contrived stretching to be seen. I think the latte art speaks for itself.
http://madcapcoffee.com/?portfolio=latte-art-by-hybrid-media

genecounts wrote:I am so grateful. The 42 second video on the GS/3 did more for me than any advice I have ever been given on Latte art in last two years. My La Spaz is a powerful steamer and I've been overdoing it apparently.

I have really been struggling steaming. You are correct, his art is not as intracate as Holly Brown's but his pour is as simple as ABC. Imagine starting at like of cup and not even prepping the surface. I admit I did use the earlier advice about just introduce a tiny amount of air and not immediately sink your wand to the bottom all the way like I've been doing. Just sink a tiny bit, perhaps halfway. Worked much better tonite.

So my wife's latte tonite didn't have a rosetta but, hey. Just wait til I have more practice since eliminating a bottleneck.

She said "that looks like a leaf"! I said, "Yeah, thats a Calla Lily leaf", since she has houseplants all over the house.
"Really"? "Absolutely I just learned that one on HB a few minutes ago".

Thanks again.

Heh, glad the thread has been helpful.

jonny wrote:Andy, I wanted to share with you a couple o' cups that you might like. Crate and Barrel has a nice 10 ounce cup, a little on the thin side and still a little large, but huge opening. http://www.crateandbarrel.com/dining-an...er/s590536
The other one I like is a 5 ounce cappuccino cup (pretty sure it is strict 5 ounces when I measured) made by Inker. It is the Low Mocca cappuccino. It's like a squashed tulip. It's my widest comp-cap. Not sure how it compares to the intelli cup though. I can measure the exact inside diameter if you are interested though. I got mine from Victrola in Seattle but you can get them plain at Orphan Espresso. http://www.orphanespresso.com/Inker-552..._4050.html

Thanks for the suggestions Jonny.

I'm always on the lookout for cups, because quite frankly, I don't think there's a single manufacturer out there who takes latte art into consideration when making a cup. Maybe Vertex is the exception, as far as the large latte design goes.

From a practical viewpoint, you want a cup to have a small mouth, because there's less exposure and better insulation. So you end up with these tall cups with small rims.

Crate and Barrel's 10" cup is a bit too large for me. I'm really not looking for a cup in that size range. I purchased the Vertex because design-wise, it had everything you wanted from a large canvas, to thick walls for great mouthfeel, to a simple-yet-edgy design. The only downfall was that I don't drink large lattes, so most of the times, I'm only filling it halfway for a regular latte or less for a cap. The times I fill the cup to the brim, is when I'm serving for someone else who prefers their coffee weak.

The Intelly cup isn't necessarily ideal for latte art, but the design is just edgy, and I couldn't find another strict 5 oz cup with thick walls. I just measured it, and the height is 2" and the rim diameter is 3.5", which beats out the Mocca cup (2.1" and 2.5" respectively).

Right now, the only cup that would interest me is probably one in the 7-8 oz range/extra thick walls with a 2" height (or less) and really, really wide mouth. Maybe something around 5".

ex trahere wrote:Not sure if this has already been posted, but I thought it was a cool vid (although a tad cheesy). It looks like a Strada, and they basically blast the steam into the milk, while keeping the pitcher entirely still--no contrived stretching to be seen. I think the latte art speaks for itself.
http://madcapcoffee.com/?portfolio=latte-art-by-hybrid-media

They're not using a Strada. I believe it's a Linea or older model.

A lot of people seem to confuse the Strada for the older models. Easy way to tell is that the Strada features exposed groupheads (LM claims better temp stability).

But the milk texture seems comparable to the Strada's. The video was helpful, thanks.

Bigbad, you obviously know your way around espresso and milk, so my comment here may or may not be overly revealing. But you mentioned earlier that you weren't using the Strada's steam at full power, instead just enough to mimic your Silvia. Since the LM's tip is so different, however - and it may well be the LM tip with the larger holes (the L-208 tip?) - is it possible that the Strada's steam is kind of sneaky-strong and although you're cranking down the exit velocity to be the same, the sheer volume of the LM is heating the pitcher of milk a lot faster regardless?

I'm just thinking that if the milk is getting to temperature much quicker, that can dramatically change its characteristics compared to a slower rise, which could account for some of the differences you've encountered. This can be especially evident to someone accustomed to requiring the foaming precision for such free-pour finesse as yourself. I had the same learning curve on a GS/3 after decades with the La Pavoni, and even with the smaller L-178 tip (and then the Foam Knife) it still took some time to get used to the higher steam volume.

Regardless, it's only a matter of time for you, so here's hoping it's quick - good luck!

Anvan wrote:Bigbad, you obviously know your way around espresso and milk, so my comment here may or may not be overly revealing. But you mentioned earlier that you weren't using the Strada's steam at full power, instead just enough to mimic your Silvia. Since the LM's tip is so different, however - and it may well be the LM tip with the larger holes (the L-208 tip?) - is it possible that the Strada's steam is kind of sneaky-strong and although you're cranking down the exit velocity to be the same, the sheer volume of the LM is heating the pitcher of milk a lot faster regardless?

I'm just thinking that if the milk is getting to temperature much quicker, that can dramatically change its characteristics compared to a slower rise, which could account for some of the differences you've encountered. This can be especially evident to someone accustomed to requiring the foaming precision for such free-pour finesse as yourself. I had the same learning curve on a GS/3 after decades with the La Pavoni, and even with the smaller L-178 tip (and then the Foam Knife) it still took some time to get used to the higher steam volume.

Regardless, it's only a matter of time for you, so here's hoping it's quick - good luck!

Thanks Anvan,

I went at it again on the Strada a few days ago, and this time, I really emphasized the texturing process to thoroughly make the foam homogenous. Again, the tip of the steam wand right below the surface, just enough that it doesn't stretch.

You're right that the Strada generally steams faster than the Silvia. I guess if I had all the time in the world, I can literally turn on the steam valve just slightly, a la what I do on the Silvia during the stretching phase. Once I've created enough foam, I'll gradually crank it to full speed to blend everything together. This usually takes around 20 seconds on the Silvia.

On the Strada, I'm usually trying to steam the milk within 10-15 seconds, 'cause I've started the shot, and I don't wanna turn off the extraction while steaming. By the time I'm done with the milk, the extraction's around 20-25 seconds in, so I'll just cut it off there.

The lack of time with steaming milk has led me to make some compromises with my technique. I feel like I'll be able to refine my technique and timing with more experience, though.

Anyway, the recent outing, I only got to pour latte art for one cap. The art was pretty mediocre, but I think I've figured out the timing. I'm gonna start the pour a lot earlier, like when the cup is 1/3 full. In the past, I think I waited too long (halfway full), and this led to the surface getting too viscous. Afterward, I was pouring macchiatos and gibraltars, so I couldn't really develop my timing.

The upcoming week, we'll be transferred to our permanent work locale which hosts a Synesso Cyncra, so it should be interesting to see if the two steam any differently. I'm sure the performance will be comparable, although the Strada makes the Cyncra look like a stone tire as far as aesthetics go...

Thanks for the update - and I'm sure paying close attention to your experience and some of the other posts will help me!

It's good to be reminded, too, of the differences you face in a professional environment - such as the virtual requirement to process the milk during the extraction - that we home-baristas in our no-time-constraint luxury don't have to think about.

Good luck with the Cyncra - it'll be interesting to hear how it compares in actual practice with the Strada if you get the time.