ha ha. What a joke!

This guy goes now as far as researching me in the internet and selecting things out. there is no way in hell any body can contradict these people!! they got tons of ways to prove things!! research this and research that, forget the many 5 stars, select this and that, and build a castle with piles of stuff to build desired conclusions

Really brilliant.

Maybe you should enjoy your coffee and stop trying to convince everyone else it is good. You are convinced, that should be enough. I read some of those reviews you keep referring to, 2 users had switched from Starbucks, 2 from Illy pre-ground, and 2 were using a super autos. Not exactly representative of the current audience.

RapidCoffee (John) is not doing research on you, do not flatter yourself. It takes no special memory or research to recall your post on CG regarding going beyond 90 seconds with a double tamp and extra finely ground stale beans, and then reporting that there was excellent taste with no flavor defects. That same thread also had the 180 second shot with similar taste descriptors.

People are choosing not to agree with your opinion. Not terribly surprising considering the audience and the subject matter. I would also say they are being very tolerant.

Perhaps you might consider abandoning this argument, at least with this audience. As for the 5 star reviews I would question any review that said something was perfect.


Gus

2 users had switched from Starbucks, 2 from Illy pre-ground, and 2 were using a super autos. Not exactly representative of the current audience

And the many others? aren't you selecting?

and then reporting that there was excellent taste with no flavor defects.

hmmm. I haven't looked but I doubt I said 'excellent'. maybe you are adding moment to your opinion. But! I remember saying 'no flavor defect'

People are choosing not to agree with your opinion. Not terribly surprising considering the audience and the subject matter. I would also say they are being very tolerant.

thanks!

Perhaps you might consider abandoning this argument

I will gracefully do it now

Sorry if I offended anybody reading this

Gus wrote:Maybe you should enjoy your coffee and stop trying to convince everyone else it is good.

I dunno, maybe you guys should enjoy YOUR coffee and stop trying to convince arpi that his is bad.

I roast my own, I have my own ideas about freshness, I won't buy beans shipped across the ocean. But I am struck by the stridency of some of the posters here. Geez, if someone likes his cup, so much the better. Is that not right? (and if you think his taste buds are crap, how is that your problem? Lighten up...)

The Topic Title is the problem.

Someone searching "Lavazza" here who's making crap shots from Lavazza needs to know the coffee is the problem.

Has it occurred to anyone else that Arpi is just an elaborate troll? Someone who knows enough about espresso to pull a really weird gag on us all by claiming that 80 second single lungos of Lavazza are the pinnacle of coffee?

Arpi wrote:Then, how come people like it so much? Are they wrong? Are they uneducated? Don't they know better?

There are limits to what can be reproduced here, not only for reasons of bandwidth, but also under the legal doctrine of "fair use." That said, here is what I consider a representative sampling:

Lavazza Italian "Super Crema" Espresso Whole Beans (2.2 lb bag):
4.5 stars, based on 8 reviews
Breakdown: 7 = 5 stars; 0 = 4 stars; 0 = 3 stars; 1 = 2 stars; 0 = 1 star; zero stars not an option

Selected quotes:

• From a 5 star review described as The Most Helpful Favorable Review: "If you love Italian dark roast coffee, this is a very enjoyable coffee. I began drinking this coffee years ago in Italy. I love the crema that forms on the top of the cup, just like being back in Italy. I do use a super automatic espresso machine"
• From a 2 star review described as The Most Helpful Critical Review: "Being a long time consumer of Lavazza Creama E Gusto which I find most enjoyable, I thought I'd give Super Creama a try.Very disapointing on flavor and fullness. For a latte I find it necessary to double the quantity in the basket and cut the milk by 80-90% so instead of a 10 oz
  double, it's a single shot espresso with a dash of milk."

Lavazza Crema e Aroma Coffee Beans, 2.2-Pound Bag:
4 stars, based on 68 reviews
Breakdown: 33 = 5 stars; 13 = 4 stars; 9 = 3 stars; 4 = 2 stars; 9 = 1 star; zero stars not an option

Selected quotes:

• From a 5 star review: "Lavazza makes excellent espresso which for a widely available "mass-market" espresso a huge step up from the American drek like "Starbucks" or anything found found in local supermarkets." (Please note the use of the term "mass market.")
• From a 5 star review: "Just made the first pot this Saturday morning for the wife and myself. Used a burr type coffee grinder and used my drip type coffee maker." (Please note the reviewer is not talking about making espresso.)
• From a 4 star review: "I use these beans in a Jura Capresso SuperAutomatic."
• From a 5 star review: "Do you love the charred flavor of Starbucks at $4 a pop for a thimbleful of overpriced swill? Then you'll feel like a Mensa genius after trying Lavazza Crema e Aroma Beans. This price is genuinely a bargain if you shop around the internet. Even if you're using a $20 grinder with a whirly bird blade and a Sam's Club espresso machine, your toes will curl with a brew of these beans."

Lavazza Italian Coffee, Qualita Oro - bean, 8.8-Ounce Bags (Pack of 4):
4.5 stars, based on 19 reviews
Breakdown: 14 = 5 stars; 2 = 4 stars; 1 = 3 stars; 1 = 2 stars; 1 = 1 star; zero stars not an option

Selected quotes:

• From a 5 star review described as The Most Helpful Favorable Review: "First things first: this is NOT an espresso roast coffee and the word espresso doesn't appear anywhere on the packaging. It's somewhere between city and full city roast and makes an excellent, full-bodied cup of drip coffee without a hint of any charred/burnt taste."
• From a 2 star review described as The Most Helpful Critical Review: "Tried various grinds with my WEGA espresso machine. Does not have the body and character to make a good espresso beverage."

And so it goes . . .

I have to admit I got carried away...and I don't even like Lavazza. But I do think there are some good Italian beans out there. The one I've used most is Molinari Bio. I think they're worth a try.

And, of course I don't mean to put down the microbreweries that attempt to make real beer. I was thinking of those that filter off half-fermented beer and bottle it with CO2. Maybe times have changed since I drank a lot of beer. Now I drink coffee in the evening!

PC

BTW, I think Mark Prince did a taste test of some Italian beans, vs local BC/PNW beans a while ago. And mostly the Italian beans lost. I think he took them off the shelf, with the idea that that was what would be available to the local consumer.

That rang a bell, Jack, so courtesy of a quick search:

Battle North America vs. Italy - The Results

The results were posted in October of 2007. The coffees included in the "test" (listed alphabetically) were:

Italian Roasters:

• Illy Medium (red ccan) Roast)
• Lavazza Qualita Oro
• Lavazza Qualitia Rossa
• Pellini Aroma d'Oro
• Pellini "Top" Espresso Blend
• Segefredo Intermezzo
• Segefredo Metropol

North American Roasters:

• Allegro Coffee Organic Bel Canto Nothern Italian Blend
• Counter Culture Roasters' Espresso Aficionado Blend
• Ecco Caffe Ecco Organic N. Italian Blend
• Ecco Caffe Ecco Reserve Northern Italian Blend
• 49th Parallel Coffee Roasters' Epic Espresso
• Intelligentsia Coffee Roasters' Black Cat

Keep in mind this was "sparked" by a debate about Kenneth David's methodology in taste-testing coffees for his publication . . .

Cheers,
Jason