dougz wrote:Thanks fellas.. I do think I would have been happier with the Classic as far as external finishing and larger water reservoir.. But oh well, that can be my upgrade down the road.. Or a Silvia..

Neither of these machines would be a real upgrade. You'd just be spending more money on things that don't really make a difference in the cup (i.e. exterior finish, and size of water reservoir). If you're going to upgrade, wait and get a serious HX machine.

dougz wrote:How can I affect brew temp? Doesn't the machine regulate that?

It does regulate temperature within a fairly wide range. You can affect the brew pressure by flushing. This is something I've only experimented a bit with. It's simple to do, but not very simple to explain. Mark Prince has a video on how to temperature surf a Silvia, that demonstrates the process.

Search "temperature surf", and you'll turn up lots of results.

My standard procedure with my Gaggia once it's warmed up and I'm ready to go is to do 3-4 short flushes, usually 2-3 seconds, until the boiler kicks in. Then I lock & load and brew the shot. The purpose of this is to bring the water temperature down to it's lower limit. Other users will have more elaborate procedures (less flushes, or a set time to wait after the boiler kicks in), for dialing in a specific temperature, but this is simple and it works pretty well for most coffees I've tried.

Huh.. Ok, I'll do a search for the procedure (and what an HX machine is), thanks..

What is the advantage to a lower temp? No risk of scalding the grind or something?

dougz wrote:Huh.. Ok, I'll do a search for the procedure (and what an HX machine is), thanks..

What is the advantage to a lower temp? No risk of scalding the grind or something?

Like any form of cooking different foods have a temperature that best suits the resulting taste profile you desire. Coffee will behave differently and give you different flavors in response to what most people would consider slight changes in brewing temperature. A running range for MOST espresso is from 195°F to 202°F but the entire range is not suitable for any given coffee blend and roast.

The true tasters who have studied this far longer than I have somewhat agree that a taste change in the cup can be noticed at .5° change in temp. I may not be that sensitive yet, but anyone can tell something is off when you get more than a couple of degrees away from the sweet spot.

-Cecil

but anyone can tell something is off when you get more than a couple of degrees away from the sweet spot

Interesting..

I guess it will take ALOT more cups of espresso before I'll be at that stage..

I DO notice that the pulls from the Gaggia are quite a bit hotter than they were from the Breville..

I mean, initially it was because I wasn't bringing the accompanying milk (I haven't tried a homemade straight espresso shot yet, or even an Americano.. Hmm.. Today's the day!) up to a decent temperature, and it brought the coffee temp down..

But now I am able to bring it up to a consistent 160F now that I have a frothing thermometer (was doing it by feel till it arrived)..

I don't notice a taste difference, really, between espresso brewed by both machines..

I wish I could have done a blind taste test between the two brews, but even then, I'm sure I don't have, maybe never will have a true connoisseur's "tongue" for coffee.. I know what I like, though..

Of course I WAS able to enjoy the flavour better from the lower temperature, as I could swish it around more, and not have to worry about burning my tongue, etc..

So I'll definitely see about getting a bit lower from the Gaggia, without it being TOO low, which I don't like, either..

If you have the steam on in your milk until it reads 160 on the needle you will be overshooting by 5-10°F. You may be slightly scorching your milk.

-Cecil

If you have the steam on in your milk until it reads 160 on the needle you will be overshooting by 5-10°F. You may be slightly scorching your milk.

You mean the thermometer is inaccurate to a certain degree, or that the milk temperature will continue to rise after I've turned off the steam?

I don't SEE the temp continue to rise after I've turned it off, according to the thermometer..

I don't think I've ever had scorched/scalded milk, it's always had a nice slightly sweet taste, so I don't have any basis for comparison, either..

Most thermometers have some lag in their reading, and any thermal system will have some carry over. Then again the Gaggia Pure could be such a slow steamer that you are not seeing either of these to the degree you might on other machines. I could run a small train from my steam wand, so I try to cut the steam by 150-155F max.

I didn't mean to confuse you, Sorry.

-C

I could run a small train from my steam wand, so I try to cut the steam by 150-155F max

So in your case you see a temperature rise even after cut-off, correct?

The increase in temperature with my wand is pretty gradual, no big spikes, and the needle stays where it is after cut-off, so I'm pretty confident I'm not going over 160.. But if 160 is the knife's edge, so to speak, maybe I should play it safe and stick to 155..

I tried an Americano today.. Meh.. Mind you, I was killing two birds with one stone and trying a POD, too..

So I'll try it with freshly-ground beans next time (if not freshly roasted.. Still have to get rid of the Starbucks before my wife will let me at the green beans)..