Hi All,

I am somewhat of a coffee newbie & have been trying to learn as much as I can - frantically reading through lots of posts, forums, & watching video's! I think I have got to the point of being able to now know what to do & how to do it correctly (with certain caveats!) but I seem to have run into a problem on which I really need some help!

I recently got a Gaggia Classic machine & at present am only using ready pre-ground coffee bought from local supermarkets - I try to buy brands that are specifically ground for espresso as I do not have a dedicated grinder yet (am saving up to buy a good one!). When I first got the machine, I followed advice according to various online video's & web advice on how to pull a decent espresso shot. I was very surprised at how good the results were - a shot would take anything between 20-30 seconds & it was a decent size amount of coffee with good thick creme. This happened with various pre-ground coffee brands.

Lately though, my Gaggia Classic seems to pull really fast shots and produces way too much volume - it can easily fill a regular size mug to about 1/2 full in about 8-10 seconds, 3/4 full in about 15 and full at or before 20 seconds. After first pressing on the pump, the coffee comes out very thin & after a about 5 or 6 seconds, there is pretty much water just coming out - almost no crema at all. I make sure I tamp very hard indeed & when emptying the basket (double shot), a solid "puck/cake" of coffee usually always forms. I have tried a number of brands of pre-ground coffee but still get the same results & I do not know why. For example, I tried Lavazza & Costa Pre-Ground previously & got good espresso's but now, am suffering with this problem with the same brands All I have done is clean the shower screen, filter baskets & portafilter.

I ensure the machine is on for at least 6 minutes before I use, fill up a double shot basket, level off, tamper very hard, preheat coffee in the mounting head, pre-heat cups & then remove heated coffee filled portafilter, switch on pump for a few seconds to ensure water is flowing, switch off pump, then re-insert coffee filled portafilter & turn pump on one final time.

To give you an idea of output, previously, I would get about 3/4 full of a standards size cup of good espresso & crema with a double basket in about 20 seconds. Now I get a full large mug of very thin "Americano" style coffee with almost no crema in 20 seconds or less. Please can someone help me out here & tell me what the problem might be? I am at a real loss - I have been googling like mad trying to find out but gave up in frustration & thought I would ask the experts on here! I know, I should "ideally" be using fresh beans & with proper grinder etc but I am fairly new to all this & am still learning whilst saving up for a decent grinder & trying to source reasonably priced fresh coffee beans locally. In the meantime (& for the foreseeable future) I will be stuck with using branded pre-ground espresso coffee - I was happy with the results achieved before & just would like the same again. I will of course do things more correctly in the future (own grinder. fresh beans etc) when I am able but ask you to look at things the way the are now - using pre-ground coffee as that is the reality! Please someone - help me out here!

Many Thanks,

Suave!

STOP pre heating the coffee. Lock & pull.

Tamp lighter & make sure it's level.

What are you using to determine amount of coffee?
Volumetric dosing is problematic as the same volume can vary considerably by weight.

If you lock and remove the PF, is the surface of the puck marked?
If so, use less coffee until the puck is not marked.
If not, try more coffee.

Suave, you will never get consistent results with pre-ground supermarket coffee. Why not look for a good hand grinder? These can be found relatively cheaply. If this is not good for you, the next best would be to go to a shop that uses freshly roasted coffee for espresso, and have them grind it for you in small batches that you use very quickly.

Hi All,

Many thanks for thee reply so far & I promise not to pre-heat the coffee anymore! As for determining volume, I use to overfill & then level off with a knife (as shown on some online videos!) & then tamp. I now have learnt only to fill in enough coffee so that there are no marks on it when it has been placed in the group head so I visually check for this but then keep adjusting the amount until there is "just" no contact with the coffee - very anal I know but that's the price for inexperience I guess!

Like I said, I am saving up to buy a decent grinder & have learn't from various posts that any old cheap one will not do - over here in London, a decent grinder can cost a fair bit & initially I was a bit concerned to buy a used/secondhand one in case I got stuck with a lemon and/or incase it's useful life was already done or fears that it would need costly servicing or be on it's last legs etc. I thought it might be best to save up and buy a better, brand new one with a warranty for peace of mind! The other problem is there that although I live just outside of London, there are very few places around me that sell fresh roasted coffee beans - I can find pre-packaged beans in the supermarkets overhear although there is somewhat of a limited choice. I would have to make a special journey into central London to some of the specialist coffee shops buy fresh roasted beans each time which is kind of a pain & works out quite costly!

They say a picture is worth a thousand words so I have just pulled a shot for you all to see & advise me of - it was done using Pre-Ground Lavazza Black Espresso Coffee (100% Arabica). The glass can hold exactly 240mls which I believe is 8.12 Fluid Ounces/0.51 US Pint. I did tamp very hard (I only have the standard Gaggia Supplied Tamper) to try & lessen the flow rate & timed exactly. It took exactly 28 seconds and the glass was full - please see pics of coffee & state of extracted puck - I am hoping that just by visualising examine these, you expert folks will be able to tell me where the likely problem might lie & how to deal with it - it simply was not happening before - once again, after about 5-6 seconds, the coffee become increasingly watery. I really hope the pictures help as I am not up to speed with all the technical terms yet!

Many Thanks,
Suave!

It is the coffee until proven otherwise.

I have a Gaggia classic at home as well. Can you post a video or pic with 16-18 gram dose of coffee in your Gaggia double porta-filter basket with just a slight tamp (5lb) to level off (you most likely will end up coming right up against the shower screen/head with that dose and using the plastic Gaggia tamper). Also, pour volume at this dose should be closer to 2-3oz rather than a full 8 oz glass. Pour should be 25-30 seconds, if not then you need to adjust the grind and get freshly roasted beans (Mail order). A grinder and fresh beans are essential to get a great pour, it makes all the difference. Many here freeze their espresso beans, that might be useful for you as well. Lastly, IMO even a half decent hand crank grinder would be better than pre-ground. Good luck

Suave wrote:I now have learnt only to fill in enough coffee so that there are no marks on it when it has been placed in the group head so I visually check for this but then keep adjusting the amount until there is "just" no contact with the coffee - very anal I know but that's the price for inexperience I guess!

If you are repeatedly inserting the PF, then adding more coffee and you started doing this just before the gushers, there's your answer. If you are tapping on the side of the PF, STOP.

Pick up a 0.1g scale for a few quid and use the same weighed dose every time.
Check the links here
Cheap Digital Scale $6 delivered until Sept. 26, 2010

If you've not seen it in your web travels, we have an Espresso Rule of 15's:
Green Coffee is good for 15 months
Roasted Coffee is good for 15 days
Ground Coffee is good for 15 MINUTES

Another axiom is the grinder makes espresso, the machine merely pushes hot water through the coffee.
Many here drink drip / FP when deprived of their espresso grinder.

sweaner wrote:It is the coffee until proven otherwise.

+1

If you're getting 8oz in 20 seconds, your coffee is both stale and too coarsely ground. No amount of shot preparation technique will change this, and anyone giving you that sort of advice is just confusing the issue.

If cost is a problem, a Kyocera hand grinder is reasonably cheap and works well for espresso. Square Mile Coffee is in London is a world-class roaster and will ship fresh coffee to you. Once you've addressed these two issues, we can work on your technique and get you making some great espresso.

Think it is more like..... If you use Illy, your coffee is stale. If you are brewing 8oz in 20 seconds your coffee is too coarsely ground. Use the tools you have not everyone can afford an Izzo. (My nice response)