HB wrote:Yikes, I think pairing a Gaggia Baby with Mazzer Major is just a tiny bit overkill.

Dan, the Mazzer will be there for the long haul. It will pair well with all of his upgrades and if bought used will be economical as well. My used Mazzer Mini cost 4 times what my used Gaggia Carezza cost.

brokemusician77 wrote:Comments like these, although cathartic for you, really don't help to address the issues I'm facing. Nor do they encourage newbies like me to continue our efforts to improve our knowledge and technique by seeking out other users.

Thanks.

My comment was tongue-in-cheek, just so you know. I agree that doubting your statement about doing research was not helpful and probably quite frustrating. I am new to this hobby also and I love it when an "old timer" welcomes me instead of making me feel stupid. Much to my disappointment I have read several posts leaning more toward the latter than the former.

And since you are in Canada, you should head over to Fratello in Calgary to see the new Slayer espresso machine (http://www.slayerespresso.com/). It is only around 500 km away and would be a fun weekend trip. I would do it if I were living that close.

Brewed some shots tonight with some very interesting results.

Seems the brew temperature may be one way to get my shots within the right range.

Even though I've been advised against some steps, for sake of consistency I brewed a couple exactly the same way. The only difference being that I ran a cooling flush right before pulling the shot. With the grinder on 8, I pulled a shot at about 30 sec. (I say about, because as luck would have it, I started the shot without starting my timer. I counted slowly to 30 and turned off the shot when it reached 2 oz. (I figure that most people count fast, so it was probably more like 28 sec.).

The crema looked good, although I probably should have stopped a little sooner due to blonding. The taste wasn't fantastic, but was in between bitter and sour. Only a little sour, and only a little bitter. With a little sugar, I could drink it as is. Actually, what I like to do with espresso sometimes is make what I call an "Air Canada". Basically an espresso macchiato with a little bit of pure Canadian maple syrup. (Aunt Jemima's will do in a pinch) It's delicious, especially with a piece of cheesecake. If I can learn to brew shots like this consistently, I think I'll be happy.

On a side note, when I turned the machine on and primed the boiler, I found that the water was already fairly warm. Even though the machine had been off for about 4 hours. (I understand you should run some water through the group right when you turn on the machine, every time you turn on the machine to prime it. Is that right?). Anyway, as I said, it was still warm after leaving the machine off for about 4 hours. From what I understand, the boiler is made of aluminum (maybe SS). It shouldn't retain heat like that. Should it? Weird.

drdna- As a full-time musician, I tour regularly and get to Calgary every few months. I am planning to hit up Fratello next time I'm there. If for nothing else than to get some fresh beans, and a nice ristretto. I also plan to hit Cafe Artigiano.

HB wrote:Besides, if I had brought in a humongous grinder like the Mazzer Major into our kitchen and plunked it down next to a small espresso machine like my old Silvia, I would have developed heatstroke under my wife's glare. If one wishes to retain some level of marital bliss, one must move slowly...

I'm a newbie as well (received my Gaggia Carezza as a Christmas Gift from my in-laws), but I've completely lucked out with my understanding husband. He's become a total enabler of my new espresso obsession, despite the fact that he himself doesn't drink coffee of any kind. I posted before about the Espro Toroid pitcher and custom engraved Reg Barber tamper he surprised me with. Well, this past Tuesday he surprised me with an early Valentines gift - a new shiny Macap M4 stepless grinder. I wanted to kiss him (eeeeeeek, great grinder!!!) and strangle him (he spent that much???) at the same time.

More in tune with the main topic of this thread, I'd like to compare what I've been able to achieve so far before, and after, the grinder upgrade. I started with a Capresso Infinity, which I think suffers from a similar problem as the OP's grinder. The grind is decently consistent, but the spacing between settings can be limiting. However, by varying my dose a bit I was able to land shots within the acceptable window, and the results were shots balanced between sour and bitter, but without much sweetness or chocolate/caramel flavors. I was happy - nearly all my shots made for a great (aka better than what the local coffee shops call a) latte. However, I knew that somewhere down the line I would like a new grinder. As another Gaggia owner, I can't stress enough how important it is to 1) let it heat up for sufficient time, and 2) do a cooling flush (or even two or three rounds of flush/wait if you have the time).

Enter hubby, and his tendency to spoil me (sometimes a wee bit too much). I powered up the Macap M4 and, before even pulling a shot, was surprised by how quiet it is. I used ~1.5 numbers above the zero point as a my starting point and started to dial in the grind. My first shot was fast, and as I dialed in the grind a little finer with each shot, I could definitely see and taste the improvements. And then, my God shot. My attempt to repeat it hasn't happened yet (as they say...user end of the handle), but I managed to get everything right (definitely with the aid of the better grinder), and that shot tasted like chocolate caramel syrup. After a few sips of it straight I decided I wanted to see how the improvements tasted in milk, so I made a cappuccino. Pure chocolate-tinged bliss. The memory of that shot has become all the motivation I need to keep practicing.

So, OP, my suggestion is just to keep on plugging with the equipment you have until YOU are satisfied that it's time and possible for something better. They say it's easier to learn to create great art if you have the best brushes, and I don't doubt it. Because with a great brush, you're guaranteed the right response when YOU do something the right way. But no brush can teach you that technique, and without technique a good brush paints like any other. So, we start with entry level equipment, and we get frustrated when our beginner level techniques are crossed with difficult to use gear. However, no matter what the gear is, on average our results will improve as our technique gets better, and we learn the hard way about the variables at play. Eventually, the machine becomes the limiting factor, as our technique has improved when the machine has not, and THAT is when we NEED (well, it could still be called want, but I'll go with need) the better equipment. I lucked out and hubby moved up the upgrade time table, but I could very well have gone along with my so-so grinder very happily until I was more confident in my own skills. I know I've yet to master consistency in my technique, which means I'll probably waste plenty of coffee adjusting my grind when it's *me* that needs adjusting!

Also, another poster here pointed out to me that as long as *you* are happy with the shots, that's all that really matters.

drdna wrote:And since you are in Canada, you should head over to Fratello in Calgary to see the new Slayer espresso machine (http://www.slayerespresso.com/). It is only around 500 km away and would be a fun weekend trip. I would do it if I were living that close.

I feel so inadequate There is, reportedly, a Slayer (3 group) installed at Cafe Beano in Calgary; that is less then 10 km from my house and I have yet to stop in.... and you're willing to drive (or at least willing to suggest that someone else drive ) 500 km to see one.

HB wrote:Besides, if I had brought in a humongous grinder like the Mazzer Major into our kitchen and plunked it down next to a small espresso machine like my old Silvia, I would have developed heatstroke under my wife's glare. If one wishes to retain some level of marital bliss, one must move slowly...

Thanks for the confidence boost Dan as I sit waiting for UPS to delivery my Mazzer Major... to put on the counter beside my Silvia. Sadly, the UPS truck is stuck in a blizzard; the road has been closed for the fourth day in a row

Today was a much better day. I pulled a couple of 2 oz. shots at 30 sec. I should have cut them off a bit sooner, around 25 sec. due to blonding, but for reference, I wanted to go a full 2 oz. The only real changes were the cooling flush, and I left out the tap between the tamp and the polish.

Randy, I read through about 6/8 of your article and in general haven't seen anything I haven't read already elsewhere. However your fresh perspective and your attention to detail was great, and there were a few subtleties I picked up that I'm sure will help. I noticed that at the finer grind setting, my grounds come out quite clumpy. I will try WDT tonight to see what difference that makes.

Feeling much more confidence, and much less buyer's remorse.

Thanks so much to everyone for your help.

HB wrote:Er, thanks Randy, but my wife doesn't drink coffee. Fortunately for me, she is exceedingly tolerant of my many encroachments on her kitchen space.

Really now! I thought I was the only one running solo on this quest. My GF made it very clear to me (after I had bought most of my gear) she would not drink anymore coffee, that my coffee ruined her day (odd, I don't remember such a statement when paying for it) and that I should buy her more stuff since I am spending it on myself (!). Fortunately, I own my house, she makes as much as I do and lives elsewhere during the week.


Hey Randy, the band link didn't work on my CPU . I did get to your face-book however. I used to play till my lips bled back in my musical days. Those damn marine band separators are made of wood and soaking would cause them to expand out of the housing. I still got a bunch of Lee Oskars kicking around here somewhere. The last jamming I was doing was to Blues traveler but that was a while ago ; ). You are not that far from me (over by Chico?) I will have to come by and have you humble me at the cup

Jef

Pulled a nice shot of decaf today (I know, I know). 25 sec., "mouse tails", nice crema, the whole bit. Hit the sweet spot bang on. No bitterness or sourness. Unfortunately, the beans must be stale, because there was nothing left in the middle. It was smooth, and I was able to drink it straight, but it tasted pretty bland. Almost watery. Still a nice warm drink, and a vast improvement over the old Hamilton Beach. Decaf through that thing was bitter and metallic.

I've been using the WDT, and have found it does make a difference.

Starting to feel much more at home on this machine. However, I am experiencing similar woes to every other Gaggia owner with regard to steaming. I think my old Hamilton Beach did a better job in that department. Oh well, one more thing to get the hang of. I know there's lots of posts on here about steaming with a Gaggia, so I'll just consult those for tips.

I cannot for the life of me, steam on my Promac. I was beginning to think it was me or the milk (or both) but last night my Dad came over so I booted up the Pavoni after pulling shots on the Promax (and espresso'ing my disdain for the steam on the Promax) then pulled a tight one with the Pavoni (almost broke the lever off ) and steamed up a frothy pitcher of milk effortlessly. I hope you have better luck on your Gaggia.
If not pick up a broken Pavoni with a good boiler and a steam wand!

Ha ha. Well, I've read about a lot of users who've removed the panarello wand and who just use the nozzle. I've seen at least two videos of people doing this and then pouring some nice rosettes. So there's hope. Lots more technique involved this way, but I guess if I wanted to take the easy route, I would have bought a super-automatic, with a milk island. No thanks!!

I just frothed up some soy milk with the Pavoni! What a champ! I may have to go back to lever only again.

I've been steaming without the panarello wand, just the tip, and it makes a huge difference. It requires some finesse, but I'm sure I'll be able to start experimenting with Latte art soon. First, I need to get some proper cups. I'm sure it's much easier if you have the wide cups, like in a cafe. Presently, I'm using a tall glass to serve Lattes in. They look fine but all my pours start a 3-4 inches above the surface of the espresso, and the rim is quite narrow.

With regard to shots, I read through the article "The Home Barista's Guide to Espresso" in the How-Tos section on this site, and paid particular attention to the section on shot diagnostics. I've been experimenting with ristrettos, lungos, center cuts, etc. Fascinating. I just got a bag of fresh beans and I'm really having fun with this now.

k

Yeah, you guys have been great. Maybe tonight I'll conclude this thread by pulling some shots and posting some pics.

I definitely feel I'm getting the hang of this setup. Although it's not ideal, it's definitely beginning to work for me (or I'm beginning to learn how to work with it).

I'm so glad for this forum. Good work folks!!

k