I'm having this issue: (on an E61 HX machine) The first shot is fine, and subsequent shots are sour. I've tried the usual techniques for sour shots: hotter water, longer pulls, but these don't get me back to the taste of the first shots. This happens with every coffee I try, although it may be worse with frozen and thawed examples. I grind fresh for each shot.

Should I wait longer between shots? Let the second pull get really blond? Only make one shot per day?

Thanks for your assistance,

Matt

Maybe the first important question is, How long between your first and second shot? And are you running any water through the machine between them (cleaning, flushing, etc.)? You need to be more specific about your routine to get answers that will be useful.

Justin

Also, what's your boiler pressure and are you allowing it to come back up before brewing subsequent shots?

Boiler pressure is 1.0 - 1.2
Brew pressure gauge says 9 bar, 10 during a backflush.

Time between shots is anything from 30 sec to 3 minutes. Little change in the second shot quality.

The Group Thermometer registers 217 when the machine has warmed up. I flush untill it reads 206 and pull immediately. (I'm assuming a 5 degree drop to the actual brew temperature.) When I pull the second shot, the group thermometer rises to anything from 207 to 210, depending on how much time since the first shot, then it decreases again to the 202-206 range.

Thank you again,

Matt

mgrayson wrote:Time between shots is anything from 30 sec to 3 minutes.

30 seconds?!? That's not long enough for your machine.

mgrayson wrote:I flush untill it reads 206 and pull immediately.

The Andreja Premium isn't a flush-n-go kind of espresso machine. Have you read hints on using the E61 thermocouple adapter?

I agree 30 seconds is nowhere near long enough. I usually do at least two minutes between shots with Anita. I've had decent success with flush-n-go, though. Have you read the Need hints on using E61 thermocouple adapter thread? If not, check it out.

I usually use Eric's method of flushing (from idle) to way below the desired brew temp and then letting it rebound to about 2.5 degrees below desired. For example, if the GH is idle at 212, I start the flush and it bounces up to 216 or so and then starts coming down. I usually stop the flush around 185. The temp readout then jumps back up to show GH temp which is declining. It will usually come down around 193 or so and then slowly recover. I build the shot and then lock in the PF and pull when it's around 195 - 195.5 or so, depending on the blend, etc. YMMV, of course. That usually works really well and the machine can rebound back to that temp for another shot in a couple of minutes.

You can also try flushing (from idle, 212+) down to your target temp or slightly below and immediately (within 10 sec) pull the shot. That works well for me, but only if the GH has stabilized at high idle. If it is somewhere in between, say around 206-207, then it won't work the same way (I think). Just be sure you're not flushing too much before your second shot. You probably don't need to flush any if it's within a couple of minutes of your first. Good luck!

Justin

Eric,

I can't put my hands on the calibration numbers right now, but I moved the thermometer from 1/4" to 3/8" protrusion and my peak number is now 212.5.

I'll let you know how the shot pulling goes in the morning. Can't drink the stuff this late

Thanks,

Matt