Thanks again to all of you for your answers and suggestions. Last three days of work were full tilt, so this has been my first chance to reply with comments.

jesawdy wrote:On a shoestring budget, I would consider a cheap but good used grinder, or possibly a handmill, a French Press, and maybe the AeroPress. Continue using your current machine and see where you can get with a better grinder. Explore French press and maybe the AeroPress (not espresso but a good brewing method) for some other low cost but good alternatives.

Have done a bit of reading now to compare French Press with AeroPress and am having a difficult time deciding which would suit me more. The idea of less sediment points to Aero, but the more caffeine and oils points to French. What the heck, eventually I'll end up with both, so it probably doesn't matter which one to start with.

mattwells wrote:I was thinking of a lever machine (like a La Pavoni - probably $300 from e-bay) and a hand grinder (depending on market $50 - $100 on e-bay, often less). Putting you somewhere around $400. Change the Pavoni to a Gaggia and you could end up around $300 - maybe less if you have patience on e-bay.

Okay, probably gonna have to put a hold on a machine for a while, but am definitely investigating a good burr grinder. Now that we know what our tax return is me thinks a grinder blinks at the end of the tunnel . . . or is that an oncoming train . . .

Cathi wrote:What I find the most encouraging about your post(s) is that you are learning to make the most out of what you have. When you are able to upgrade, you will appreciate it that much more. Kudos to you.

Thanks, I appreciate that sentiment. My mother always tells me, "Use it up, wear it out. Make it do or do without." Hence, the daily headstand while watching my not espresso drip out of my fake NPF, just happy to see the stalactites converge into a single cone, if only for a moment. I'm sure when the good equipment comes my way I'll appreciate it like I appreciate the college education I paid my way through.

Cathi wrote:Are you looking for the beginner/minimum set up? Or can you stretch a bit more for an HX (sometimes you can find them re-sell for hundreds less)? . . . Put the bulk of your money toward the grinder. Look for a resale Rocky or Cunill Tranquilo at a minimum. Rossi's, Rio's and Super Jolly's sometimes come up for sale at very good prices, but these are huge commercial machines and are few and far between. Probably the last grinder you would ever buy.

Beginner when I get that far. For now it looks like a solid grinder (hopefully one that will last for years to come) and FP or AP. The grinder is more than half the battle anyway, right?

Cathi wrote:Pairing either of those [FP or AP] with a hand grinder (ie Kym or Armin Trosser) is the thriftiest way to go. Not espresso, but, espresso flavor on the cheap!

Should my desire for the solid grinder fail, I'll probably try out a hand grinder. Were those two brands just given as examples, or as the best quality ones and to avoid the others?

HB wrote:The inherent problem with steam-driven pressure coupled with an aluminum group is how quickly the water temperature will rise above desirable brew temperatures.

Yep, I've seen the boiling water come out the bottom of the basket, at which point I yank the carafe as quickly as humanly possible.

HB wrote:Another inexpensive option is the All-Clad Presso (be careful not to break the arms!). They're frequently on eBay where the cost of shipping is greater than the Presso.

I'm going to see if I can find one of these in addition to either a FP or AP. Looks like an interesting contraption that will at least provide some amusement and conversation.

HB wrote:Everyone has a "steam toy" in their closet (true confessions)

You took my only machine while I wasn't looking! Give it back! No, don't give it back, I'd rather have one of the others.

RapidCoffee wrote:Another hint: if you must use the steam toy, at least pull the brewing carafe before the brew cycle finishes, certainly at the first hint of steam coming through the puck. That will cut down on bitterness.

Thanks, I'd been paying attention for boiling liquid, but hadn't thought about the steam. It does help.

cannonfodder wrote:The above posts address your questions very well. I will only add that an exceptional cup of coffee beats the pants off marginal espresso, or psudo espresso.

True, true. Now if I can just make an exceptional cup . . . ahhhh.

cannonfodder wrote:A French press pot will make a very good, bold and flavorful cup of coffee that will stand up to some milk, best of all, they are very cheap.

This is good news since I really love the smoothness and thicker texture that properly foamed milk adds. My biggest problem to date has been getting enough coffee flavor to cut through without being bitter.

cannonfodder wrote:Even with your current kit, you would experience a quantum jump in quality if you upgrade to a burr grinder. You may want to take a look at the Best Inexpensive Grinder and Best espresso gear on a student's budget?. As others have suggested, you can also go with a hand mill. You get a good grind for very little cash, not to mention some exercise cranking the handle.

I've read those posts a few times now and appreciate your pointing me to them. Hopefully a good burr grinder will be in my near future. If not, perhaps my triceps will look better

As for good old fashioned hand grinders. The best way to get them is on ebay. Look for a Zassenhaus, or Armin Trosser. But watch out. Make sure that they are adjustable models. A quick message to the seller should confirm this. Another good hand grinder option is a Turkish/Greek coffee mill. These are also readily available on ebay. They look like big cylinders, in brass. Really quite beautiful. Not as easy to adjust the manual grinders but if you are using one brewing method (like French Press) they can pretty much be set and left the same. They also do not heat the coffee (or at least not as much as other grinders). This alone can make a BIG difference in your coffee quality. Expect these also to take more time than other grinders and give you some exercise! A Zass or Trosser can be had for $30-60 (or around there).
A turkish mill can be had for anywhere from $30-150.

For great coffee, inexpensively made, it is almost impossible to beat the French Press. A 32 oz. model is easily in the price range of $30. This thirty bucks will last you for years and years and will still be used often after you have your espresso machine. Coupled with a hand grinder that is adjusted to the proper grind a french press will have very little sludge. Once you have one it is all about practice and proper brew time(isn't it always though). With the press you can make a cafe au lait that will at least give you some similarities to a latte. To make this brew strong coffee in the press. Then steam some milk with your Krups. (still useful!) and mix 50/50. Lovely drink with breakfast!

Espresso machine wise. Be Patient and look around. There are SO SO SO many models and companies out there. Many have models in the range of $150-300. While these require learning and practice (and working with the machines limitations), they can produce actual espresso. Maybe not to the level that a $400+ machine can but certainly much better than the steam toy you have. Use the french press or aeropress to tide yourself over until you find a lower end model that you can afford. Slowly. Heck it may take you 2-3 years. I waited 5 years to buy the machine I wanted. (I work as a barista though so I got to practice for all those years) It can be done! In the slow saving up for the machine you might also find that you can save more than you thought allowing you to upgrade before you ever had the machine.


To sum up. You could have a great coffee set up for $60-170. Pre espresso machine.
With the machine You could possibly get the grinder and machine for 250-300. More yes, but it might be possible.
If you find something that looks interesting, post on this board and ask. There is a very good possibility that someone will have some good usable feedback about that particular machine.

Good luck. Hope your caffeination goes well.

Lynn

Kaffee Bitte wrote:Once you have one it is all about practice and proper brew time(isn't it always though). With the press you can make a cafe au lait that will at least give you some similarities to a latte. To make this brew strong coffee in the press. Then steam some milk with your Krups. (still useful!) and mix 50/50. Lovely drink with breakfast!

Thank you very much for your feedback. As an update, did buy a french press a couple days ago and attempted my first cup with it. This obviously is going to take more practice. How much grounds should I be using to make it super strong? After following the directions found elsewhere I ended up w/ six oz of coffee mixed with my normal amount of steamed milk and found it too watery for my taste. I'm sure this is my lack of experience. I did, however, manage to avoid the sludge.

Also got my first shipment of fresh coffee from Sweet Maria's and man, is it awesome! So my journey continues . . .

In order to brew for a cafe au lait here is what I do. Instead of measuring by grams I tend to grind my coffee and fill the press to the point where there is coffee in contact with the plunger when it is depressed. It shouldn't take you too long to get used to measuring the amount of coffee that it requires for this. I am much more careful in dosing my espresso, but the press is much more forgiving. Coffee brewed at this stated amount should be quite potent and should not be over powered by the milk at a ratio of 50/50. I may not be right about this, but I believe this is near the brew that the french would use in making their cafe au laits. They would call this double strength. I have tried using more coffee than this even, but it isn't really much stronger and doesn't make a big difference in cafe au lait. It also will tend towards the bitter side of things.

HB is correct in the fineness of the grind. It may take you multiple pots before you narrow the grind size to the proper setting. Once you have it though it is easily repeatable. You will know that you ground too fine when the plunger is difficult to depress. If the plunger doesn't depress at all or moves only with great effort, you have ground too fine. You will know you have ground too coarse if the plunger is very easy to depress. Look for the middle of the road. A good way to get an idea of a grind that is too fine is to go buy a half pound of beans at a local coffee shop and ask them to grind for drip. This will give you an idea of what you are looking for. (It may be though that the grind they give you will be just right for the press) Coffee shops aren't always good about setting their grinders properly. Anyway try their grind and see what happens.

As far as the weakness of the coffee with milk. What was the amount of milk you mixed with the 6 oz of coffee. Was it 6 oz as well. If so you should definitely try brewing in the way I described above. Another thing that may help is that you should expect sludge in the bottom of the cup, If you aren't getting any it is a sure sign that you have not ground fine enough.

Some trouble shooting advice. If you find you are using this much coffee and still isn't strong enough, there are several things that could be off in the process.

1. the grind may be too coarse.
2. the brew time may need to be adjusted. (with a finer grind go with HB's recommendation.) If you are having difficulty getting the grind fine enough let the brew time stretch a little longer. Try 4.5 minutes or 5 or even edging on six if need be. (adjusting grind should be the first thing you try though.) PLEASE DON'T GO PAST SIX MINUTES! (very bad coffee)
3. If it still isn't strong enough, you could try brewing with even more coffee. You could also try a different blend or perhaps a darker roast.

And finally another question for you. Using the blade grinder to grind for this? If so it may be impossible to get an even grind that will produce amazing french press coffee. There are options in the burr grinder category that are not suitable for espresso but are highly workable for press pots. These do not produce as fine a grind or as consistent a grind as more expensive burrs but it will do the trick. They are also more affordable. I am still going to recommend going with the hand mill overall though, for consistency, stepless adjustability, and truly excellent coffee flavor. Also they will run you about the same, maybe less than the electric burr grinders.

Lynn

I use one tablespoon of ground coffee per 5oz of water. I dose into the FP, add my water just off a boil (or right out of the water tap on my Elektra) to the grounds and start my timer (4 min). After the first minute I stir the grounds with the handle of a wooden spoon and then let it sit for the remaining 3 minutes. Then press the pot.

Getting the grind is the hard part. You will probably have to try 4 or 5 grind settings before you zero in on what works best for you. Keep in mind, the finer the grind the shorter the steep length.