RegulatorJohnson wrote:have you noticed any grit grinds in the cup after you drink the coffee?

jon

None at all.

RapidCoffee wrote:Unfortunately, quality control on espresso filter baskets, especially ridgeless baskets, appears to be sorely lacking.

Yes! I took a look at my unused LM ridgeless double under a microscope at work and I was amazed. Its very irregular in hole diameters, lots of torn metal, folded stuck chunks, unpunched particles.

RapidCoffee wrote:One of my 18g ridgeless doubles from the great Synesso basket buy was poorly stamped, and I handled it the same way. Keep in mind that a dissecting needle is not a hole punch for aluminum. It was tedious and difficult to punch through even the prestamped holes in the basket, and I saw no evidence that the holes were widened beyond their "normal" diameter by this treatment.

Tedious is the word. Using pin gauges I measured the holes in the stock Silvia baskets at .014 - .015". These holes looked cleanly cut, rounded and consistent. I also measured the holes in my 'WDT Tool Punched' LM double basket at .018", very round, no extra metal bits and consistent diameter throughout the basket. They may be widened somewhat but not knowing what was the manufacturer targeted hole diameter makes it hard to say how much.

RapidCoffee wrote:So I really don't think you need to worry about damaging the filter when cleaning clogged filter basket holes with a WDT tool. I've done this on several occasions, when one or two holes resists the green scrubbie treatment. In this case, a gentle poke from a needle or dental pic is just what the doctor ordered.

Agreed.

cafeIKE wrote:If you have an unplumbed drip tray, drain the tray, place the basket in the drip tray and do a detergent backflush. Spotless every time.

It wouldn't have worked for me. I hit those babies with a super strong mix of BOILING Joe-Glo, scrubbing while boiling and then blasting 100psi compressed air into each and every hole with no effect. Had to resort to the 'pick'.

cannonfodder wrote:It may just be the photo, but those holes look way too large now.

I think it is just the photo. The shot was taken toward the late afternoon diffused sky from the bottom of the basket. The holes are tapered on that side and light reflection in the taper is making them look larger. They do look big! What a big difference from the pic on the left.

The technical side of me wants to know what diameter the designers had in mind when making the basket holes. I like to think years of engineering expertise went into determining exactly what diameter hole worked best for espresso extraction. But maybe not - and it probably doesn't matter much. What I am sure does matter are flaws in manufacturing, contamination, products outside the manufacturing process parameter window will influence a products usability. I am quickly learning that my new found passion for preparing espresso is a hard process to control, to understand, to master (good luck!), but a whole lot of fun to be involved with!

George

My standard LM portafilter basket has very nice looking pin sized holes. I would say the holes are smaller than the one you show for your cleaned ridgeless. Who manufactures those ridgeless?

It's an interesting design on the LM standard basket. Each pin sized hole is surrounded by a periphery of thin, flat metal that meet up with a larger hole. I would think if I tried to poke through the hole, I might puncture out the thin metal and open it up much farther than was originally intended by the designers.

I've used a needle to clear holes in my SBux Barista filter basket before. LIGHT pressure and verify that the holes APPEAR the same as the others. No "Get the pin gauges out to insure the holes haven't gotten larger", just a quick visual check. Nowadays, I use my Branson Ultrasonic cleaner to do a "deep clean" of the baskets (both the Barista and my Gaggia Factory) once a week. I leave the baskets in for at least 30 minutes and usually 1 hour. They come out REAL clean! I use EITHER CleanCaf or sometimes a "moderate" solution of citric acid.

roblumba wrote:My standard LM portafilter basket has very nice looking pin sized holes. I would say the holes are smaller than the one you show for your cleaned ridgeless. Who manufactures those ridgeless?

Good question Rob. I don't know who manufactures them and I should not refer to them as LM baskets. They were sold as 'Marzocco Style' ridgeless baskets. No doubt the real LM baskets you have are higher quality.

roblumba wrote:It's an interesting design on the LM standard basket. Each pin sized hole is surrounded by a periphery of thin, flat metal that meet up with a larger hole. I would think if I tried to poke through the hole, I might puncture out the thin metal and open it up much farther than was originally intended by the designers.

I still have an unused, un-poked basket at home. I'll have to take a closer look at the hole design with the scope.

Now I am really intrigued by what the designers had intended for the basket holes. Any designers out there not sworn to an NDA?

George

I pulled out my set of 61-80 drills and checked the 2 baskets that came with my Brutus II and the triple basket that came with the bottomless portafilter from Chris. The holes vary from smaller than the .0135" #80 drill to a few big enough to fit a .018" drill. All three show the holes are bigger at the edges and most of the holes are smaller than a #79, .0145" drill. If you wanted to make all the holes the same size, I'd suggest a #78 or #79 drill and a pin-vise. It will let you get all the holes the exactly same size with no missed holes and no accidents.

Ira

Had the exact same problem with my LM-style 18g ridgeless from Espressoparts.com. It was not nearly as bad as the example in your post, but close. I was getting a "leaning column" effect no matter how I prepped the basket, so I looked at the holes and about a half dozen on one side were not punched as well as the rest. Pin gauge measured holes at 0.014 average size before fixing with a 0.014 pick. .015 avg after touching up every hole for consistency.

Before:


After:


The column straightened right out. I had to adjust my grind ever so slightly, but now I also get less flash-blonding at the edges of the basket, too.

Cheers