Better Espresso thru Freezing - Page 11

by **JohnB.** on Wed Jan 06, 2010 4:13 pm

I've yet to see this often mentioned condensation materialize on the cold beans. I pulled a vac bag out of the freezer yesterday, cut it open immediately & dumped some of the beans on the counter. At no time did any moisture appear on the bean surface & when I rubbed them with my fingers none was visible on my hand. This morning I took a valve bag of beans out of the freezer, poured 42g into a plastic container for the vac pot & once again no visible moisture/condensation appeared on the beans at any time. If the amount of condensation is so minor that it can't be seen if indeed there is any it certainly doesn't seem that it would be an issue.

by **another_jim** on Wed Jan 06, 2010 4:32 pm

It's winter, and the air is bone dry.

by **shadowfax** on Wed Jan 06, 2010 4:38 pm

Coffee is also porous, even at ~0°F. As I've said I don't anticipate grinding frozen beans is a problem given user reports contradicting this, but I also don't think the "rub on my fingers" method is a useful way of quantifying, even roughly, the level of condensation that beans experience when exposed to ambient air while still cold.

by **JohnB.** on Wed Jan 06, 2010 6:03 pm

another_jim wrote:It's winter, and the air is bone dry.

True but I do have an humidifier running a few feet from the coffeebar so the air shouldn't be too dry. I've done this at other times of the year and never seen anything on the beans then either.

by **JohnB.** on Wed Jan 06, 2010 6:08 pm

shadowfax wrote:Coffee is also porous, even at ~0°F. As I've said I don't anticipate grinding frozen beans is a problem given user reports contradicting this, but I also don't think the "rub on my fingers" method is a useful way of quantifying, even roughly, the level of condensation that beans experience when exposed to ambient air while still cold.

So if there is so little moisture on the cold beans that it can't be seen or felt would YOU be concerned about it? Personally I think the invisible condensation is a non issue so I'll say no more.

by **chang00** on Thu Jan 07, 2010 1:52 am

This is probably the said article; I don't have Scott Rao's book to verify:

http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/jf0...istoryKey=

by **farmroast** on Thu Jan 07, 2010 11:19 am

We do consider moisture content to some degree when we are roasting so maybe it is a factor when making espresso. What if you threw some beans in a cup of water for say 30mins and then surface dried them, grind and pulled a shot? Would it make any difference? If so then how much makes a difference. You could weigh some beans with a high resolution scale and freeze them and then watch their condensation weight gain after exposing them again.

by **cannonfodder** on Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:09 am

A passing comment.

I recently moved into my new home. While moving my two deep-freezers I came across a bag of greens. I vac pack my greens and freeze them. It dramatically extends the life of the bean. While moving one of the freezers, I came across about 3 pounds of MAO Horse that had been sitting at the bottom of the freezer, sealed and at -30'ish since mid 2007, two and a half years old. Most would agree that a good Harrar is a nuanced coffee and when it dies, it dies and goes flat and bland fast. I got the bag out, let it warm up and put it into the roasting rotation. I was expecting flower bedding quality coffee after that long nap but I was quite surprised at the results. It still roasts up very nice. I will not say it was as delicate and nuanced as it was two and a half years ago but it is still a very respectable coffee. Keep in mind, these are greens not roasted coffee.

by **cafeIKE** on Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:53 am

cannonfodder wrote:I will not say it was as delicate and nuanced as it was two and a half years ago but it is still a very respectable coffee.

Some guys will be all over you because you didn't blind A-B test with a cup from 30 months ago. :roll:

While I don't freeze greens, some pro roasters have told me sealed very deep freeze [-40°F/C --] keeps greens almost 'indefinitely'

by **Couloirman** on Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:30 pm

So, whats the longest anyone has frozen roasted beans for and then used them to brew espresso? How'd it taste? Ive got a big bag of single origin from intelligentsia sitting in my freezer that I purchased in October,so that is why I am asking.


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