I'm sure I'll be opening a can of worms with this question - but the obsession that many coffee enthusiasts have with tampers is a bit beyond me.

So, how necessary is a "good tamper" really?

With the exception of the choice of flat vs. curved it would seem to me that it's really a question of "what you do with it" and not the size, make and shape etc. I've been using the simple piece of plastic that came with my old Gaggia Classic (or was it the MDF grinder?) and it seems to do the job just fine.

If you do a lot of cups every day a nicely ergonomic handle would be better of course, but beyond that?

Cheers

I've said it before: The tamp is near the bottom of my list of important contributors to exceptional espresso. But I'm a fan of craftsmanship and well-made tampers showcase good craftsmanship. Are they overrated? Sure. By the same token, so are Motta pitchers, illy collection cups, and many other expensive pieces of top-notch barista kit. The surface of a coffee puck doesn't know the difference between a prefabricated Made in China tamper or a TORR tamper skillfully made with rare wood and precision machining; but I do.

Tampers are Barista Jewelery

For home baristas, they are pure jewelry. For professional baristas, who deal with repetitive stress injuries, the ergonomics come first, and then the jewelry side.

cafeIKE wrote:Tampers are Barista Jewelery

Well I certainly don't want to tread on any Barista toes by dissing their bling-bling

Just wanted to make certain I wasn't missing something.

Cheers,
Claus

cafeIKE wrote:Tampers are Barista Jewelery

No, they're not. Ever tried a shot of espresso through a diamond-crusted grill? You'll change your mind about iced espresso!

I have said it before, a bad tamp will ruin a good dose, but no amount of tamping will fix a bad dose. The tamp simply insures there is an even puck of coffee void of air pockets. Having said that, I do appreciate the artistic work that goes into some tampers and I am no good at pulling shots without one although that is the norm in Europe.

cannonfodder wrote:I have said it before, a bad tamp will ruin a good dose, but no amount of tamping will fix a bad dose. The tamp simply insures there is an even puck of coffee void of air pockets.

Dave's right

Quality craftsmanship can never be over appreciated, but I think tampers in general receive way too much critical discussion. I am particularly amazed and amused by how much attention is given to the topic of custom fit, with clearance specs befitting a Ferrari engine, and relative price tags to match. I do think a quality tool makes the job more enjoyable. But the skill in the execution of this seemingly perfunctory task will have greater impact on the result than the tool will. An el' cheapo wrench will turn a nut just as well as a Snap-on. It is the skill of the mechanic that will determine how well the engine runs.

Learning to tamp skillfully is much more important than what you are tamping with. It is a simple task that is surprisingly difficult to execute, and technique and tool vary greatly. I guess I can see how people get hung up on the subject, just not why. I think there is way too much focus on gear and not enough focus on practice. There is certainly a minimum tool kit, but the best possible results will only come from logging serious hours in front your gear, not the gear itself, and certainly not the tamper. Get what you want, but don't get hung up on it; it's a coffee ground compactor that's it.


Gus

Gus wrote:I guess I can see how people get hung up on the subject, just not why. I think there is way too much focus on gear and not enough focus on practice.

To each his own, to be sure. But in all my time lurking and posting on HB I never thought I'd read a post suggesting that there is not enough focus on any element of espresso herein. More like downright remarkable that anyone could think so.

espressoed wrote:To each his own, to be sure. But in all my time lurking and posting on HB I never thought I'd read a post suggesting that there is not enough focus on any element of espresso herein. More like downright remarkable that anyone could think so.

Perhaps you weren't lurking enough . . .

I would think most of would agree that espresso isn't a function of "one size fits all," meaning there is only one "right" way to produce a great espresso. Some people use double-boiler machines and get great results; some don't. Some may use HX machines and pull great shots; some don't. And some pull great shots on open boiler lever machines . . . and some don't. Let along the variations in grinders (the type and size of the burr set), the coffee beans (all Arabica? some Robusta? how much, and from where? roast level? and so on), and the individual pulling the shots.

For me, when Gus writes, "I think there is way too much focus on gear and not enough focus on practice," it makes perfect sense to me. Then again, since we're not all living in the same dorm, it's a bit difficult to comment on each other's techniques . . .

Thus, we talk about gear -- so much so, in fact, that there are times when it may seem that the "fourth M" (Mano dell'operatore) is unimportant, when it is actually the most important. Indeed, we spend more time talking about machines, rather than grinders, more about grinders than the beans, and more about the means than ourselves.

Seems to me there's a pattern there . . .

When it comes to tampers, most of us would agree that the plastic ones you get for free with nearly every new machine are crap. But beyond that . . .

HB wrote:I've said it before: The tamp is near the bottom of my list of important contributors to exceptional espresso.

Keep in mind it remains an "important contributor," not an unimportant one. But I'm with Dan -- as long as it gets the job done, the rest is all "extra."

Just my 2¢ -- worth far less, I'm sure - keep the change.

Cheers,
Jason

zin1953 wrote:Keep in mind it remains an "important contributor," not an unimportant one.

Let me put it another way: A raw newbie with 10 minutes of qualified instruction will tamp properly; they might need a refresher the next day requiring an additional 5 minutes. Other than that, they're pretty much good to go for life. The same newbie with an hour of instruction will struggle to diagnose the cause of an uneven extraction without assistance. The same newbie with an additional hour of instruction will still struggle to diagnose the cause of common taste defects.

Bottom line: If you're having trouble getting the tamp right, you've really got a problem.

Gus wrote:An el' cheapo wrench will turn a nut just as well as a Snap-on.

The analogy to a wrench is appropriate. It takes just about as much skill to tamp a puck as it does to turn a nut.

I agree with Dan: other mechanical aspects of puck preparation and shot pulling require much more skill than tamping. Diagnosis and correction of taste defects, via adjustment of grind, dose, brew temp and pressure, is far more difficult. I still consider myself a novice in that arena.

zin1953 wrote:Perhaps you weren't lurking enough . . .

Are you trying to suggest my lurking was in some way deficient? Dude, I lurked long and I lurked hard. Where I come from they call me Dr. Lurkenstein, King of all lurkers.

zin1953 wrote:For me, when Gus writes, "I think there is way too much focus on gear and not enough focus on practice," it makes perfect sense to me. Then again, since we're not all living in the same dorm, it's a bit difficult to comment on each other's techniques . . .

Thus, we talk about gear -- so much so, in fact, that there are times when it may seem that the "fourth M" (Mano dell'operatore) is unimportant, when it is actually the most important. Indeed, we spend more time talking about machines, rather than grinders, more about grinders than the beans, and more about the means than ourselves.

Seems to me there's a pattern there . . .

That's an overt pattern to be sure, but isn't there also a hidden pattern? Doesn't our conversation regarding the three other "M's" and their ancillary topics on HB frequently include discussion of the "fourth M" within?

zin1953 wrote:Just my 2¢ -- worth far less, I'm sure - keep the change.

Don't ever discount yourself, Jason.

I'm glad my question spawned some vivid discussion among both lurkers and non-lurkers.

I still say that even though the piece of plastic that came with my machine is "a piece of crap" I still find that it gets the job done. If someone gave me a better tamper for my next birthday the plastic one would probably end up in the bin though...

My next post will be "Are grinders overrated or are a pestle and mortar good enough, really?"

I think that worse is,other than not doing the job, a danger with those plastics,that they may break,and injure your hand.
It was for this reason,when I changed to a RB,some years ago.

Marshall wrote:For home baristas, they are pure jewelry. For professional baristas, who deal with repetitive stress injuries, the ergonomics come first, and then the jewelry side.

I second this statement. You can get by with darn near any tamper, but after five days of eight-hours of serving drinks, you'll start to feel it if your tamper isn't ergonomically sound.

That's why I love RB.

But this is also Home barista not pro barista. In your average home it is far less important but having said that. I turn my own handles on the lathe so they fit my stubby ham hock of a hand just right. I have 3 or 4 tampers and appreciate the craftsmanship that went into each one, but they are all still just a fancy coffee hammer.

Five minutes ago I pulled a 14g shot (of Ethiopian Bonko) on my rotary machine. For the first time in my recollection, I completely forgot to tamp, at all, and only realized what I'd done after I locked the PF in the machine. Thinking of this thread, I decided to just go ahead and pull the shot with no tamp whatsoever.

It was a normal looking gooey shot that poured out of the bottomless PF in my machine. It tasted just fine, also. There is no way I could have distinguished that shot from any other I have pulled with the benefit of tamping, at least not since I started dosing in this vicinity.

ken

Here's another tack ...

The tamper makes a fine distribution and leveling tool. Just roll the piston around its edge (and basket edge) once or twice, and the cake is distributed. For the technically minded, this is called nutation. Now use your ring finger and thumb at the piston sides to gauge the depth of the piston and rotate the basket or PF 180 degrees, making sure its the same depth all round. Now you're level. If you want to give it a light press after that, no sweat.

If you distribute and level without using a tamper, IMO, you may as well use the plastic one on the doser.

Danger! Danger! Warning, Will Robinson! Boring philosophical thread drift ahead!

espressoed wrote:That's an overt pattern to be sure, but isn't there also a hidden pattern? Doesn't our conversation regarding the three other "M's" and their ancillary topics on HB frequently include discussion of the "fourth M" within?

Far be it for me to be a contrarian, but . . .

Let's make vast over-generalizations and -simplifications for a moment and proclaim there are only three types of people on this site: lurkers and true newbies, true experts and/or professionals, and the rest of us -- who possess varying degrees of experience ranging from a "10" to a "90" on some mythical scale; with the lurkers being a 0-10, and the pros being 90-100. (This is a variation on the famed "80-10-10 Rule.")

It often seems to me that, in terms of importance, the "Four M's" are typically listed in reverse order of importance: rather than Macchina espresso (machine), Macinadosatore (grinder), Miscela (blend of coffee beans), and Mano dell'operatore (us -- the people who pull the shots), it should be the other way 'round. And yet, it is that order which dominates the discussion . . .

Thus, it is distinctly, possible if not probable, that many new people to espresso focus too much on the equipment and not enough on the coffee itself and upon the technique . . . that's all I'm really saying here.

Cheers,
Jason