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And sometimes you have to updose - Page 3

Postby Ken Fox on Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:58 am

drdna wrote:I think the new Sweet Maria's Espresso Workshop blends are exactly the thing you have been waiting for.

Adrian


Although I do occasionally buy green coffee from SMs, they are not a major supplier for me. If I was seeking blends, there are others I would seek out than SM (just my bias).

I usually follow Jim Schulman's recommendations for specific green coffees suitable for SO espresso. He knows my taste (or lack thereof) and has a much better track record in my experience than most people when it comes to choosing coffees for SO espresso use.

The one type of blending that I do occasionally do is to blend in an aged coffee (like the now-gone 2004 aged Lintong that the Coop and Paradise had in the past), with an SO that is "fading" and beginning to lose its flavor interest, as sometimes happens when green beans are stored a bit too long. A quick and easy blend of 25% of the aged coffee can revitalize a dying SO. A couple of times I've had pretty spectacular results with such blends. The Ethiopian Biloya that so many raved about was a disappointing coffee for me, much like the Ethiopian Awassa. Both apparently cupped much better than they worked for SO espresso. When I added 25% of the aged Lintong to the Biloya, however, I got a sum that was greater than the parts.



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Postby malachi on Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:27 pm

drdna wrote:Yes, and also Kona as a SO espresso seems to demand updosing.


Interesting - I find they get muddy at high doses and lose some of the delicateness.
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Postby malachi on Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:36 pm

Ken Fox wrote: In fact, the only Amazingly good non-blended ("SO") Red wines of France that I can think of are Burgundy, which is 100% Pinot Noir, and a few from the Northern Rhone Valley (which are Syrahs). There are a few other oddball French "SO" red wines, some made from Cabernet Franc and Pinot Noir, but most of the famous wines of France are in fact blends.


The french truly have specialized in creating great blended grape wines. They have practiced for centuries to get to this point.

To be fair, however, there actually are a lot of non-blended wines from France. It's just that the French aren't obsessed with the topic and rarely message the "100%" nature of a wine. Even Bordeaux has a fair number of non-blended wines (Chateau Lamartine and Chateau Haut-Ballet come to mind). The ironic thing is that many of the "greatest" blended wines from France are more than 90% one single grape (Le Pin, Petrus, etc).

The US obsession with non-blended wines has always seemed like it is more related to label confusion and marketing than anything either cultural of taste-related.
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Postby DavidMLewis on Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:31 pm

Ken Fox wrote:I'm sure that many regard me as some sort of fringe character, however blends for the most part do not interest me. Single varietals are where it is at, for me, and in the very small universe of SOs that can work for espresso, most will be dry processed Africans and most will do just fine at about 14g.

Hi Ken,

As to your first point, that would be "yes". I just wanted to mention that at the USBC, Sarah Ferguson of the Abbey (a few blocks from my house) was using a "blend" the folks at Verve did for her. Two Wondo Worka Yirgs, 75% natural, 25% washed for the florals. By all reports it was extraordinary; they promised to save me some when I get back home. I suspect you'd like it.

Best,
David
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Postby k7qz on Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:15 pm

Address7 wrote:So far, I have played with Black Cat, Coffee Klatch Belle Espresso and PT's Bella Vita (currently in the house). To my buds, all of these blends taste best updosed and pulled tight.


I've tried the down-dose circuit as well. Agreed, it seems best (but not entirely) suited for SO's. Otherwise as simplistic as it may sound, I've gone back to more or less sticking with the roaster's recommendations for my dose/temp profiles for their blend. For instance, this is from PT's site for the aforementioned Bella Vita:

Guide to Ideal Extraction:
Dose Weight: 21 grams (on Astoria or similar machines you should use triple baskets)
Extraction Time: 26-28 seconds (for a double shot)
Volume: Two 1oz shots


I've tried Bella Vita in various doses (15, 16, 18 grams etc.) and surprise, surprise it's best at 21 grams pulled in 26 or 28 seconds just like PT's says... :wink:

[For roasters who may read this- I appreciate those sites who list blend dose/temp/time guide lines on their sites. It makes for an easy starting place with a blend]
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Postby shadowfax on Mon Mar 09, 2009 4:19 pm

Michael, I thought I'd throw in a curious "stupid machine-specific waste of time bs question." What basket do you use for 21g shots on the A3?
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Postby another_jim on Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:43 pm

3.25 basket. 19 grams is the screen-limit on triples for the Elektra group.

On a more serious note. It may be that shot temperature is mostly a function of dose, the higher the dose, the higher the required temp. If people follow the moron-mantra of one variable at a time, they'll always settle in on the one temperature that's appropriate for their dose or the one dose that fits their temperature. Then they become fanatic about it, because it was found using the sacred one variable at a time procedure.
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Postby cafeIKE on Mon Mar 09, 2009 7:26 pm

Jim, 'moron-mantra' is a bit harsh. Surely you're not suggesting Joe n00b change the grind, dose, and temperature all at the same time.

Once you've pulled a few thousand sinkers and know how coffee's respond, you can take off the training wheels.
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Postby another_jim on Mon Mar 09, 2009 11:00 pm

I think it's a moron mantra. If the shot is fast or slow, change the grind, if its weak or strong, change the dose. But if the shot is both, you only get to change one; how stupid is that? You are dialing in a coffee; so use whatever clues you can find, and if you can't find any; make up a few.

If you're a beginner, a few things change. Make sure the pressure and temperature are reasonable, then don't change them at all. If your a rank beginner, don't even change one variable until you've bought bottomless and know the fast/slow, weak/strong whatever/not-whatever isn't because your shot just channeled all over the counter.
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Postby smillions on Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:14 am

cafeIKE wrote:Jim, 'moron-mantra' is a bit harsh. Surely you're not suggesting Joe n00b change the grind, dose, and temperature all at the same time.

Joe N00b here with a question: :) Assuming that I have found the magic combination to give me an approximately 25 second extraction and I want to play with the dose to see how that changes the taste, don't I have to change the grind when I change the dose? Seems to me that I would be wasting a lot of coffee if I only changed one at at time. I agree that changing everything at the same time seems unscientific, if you are trying to understand the impact of your changes on the taste of the coffee; but, given "the fundamental interconnectedness of all things", I'm not sure you can change just one thing...
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