actually, the Mistral is not an HX machine but rather a dual boiler machine. with it, the flush is to bring the group up to temp rather than down.

that being said, i do base my methodology on what one would do with a commercial E61 based machine. but... i start from a deadpoint by doing a considerable flush to force autofill and heating element then time initially off the element shutting off. from there i go into a 'traditional' commercial flush mode (because, as noted below, i don't have to worry about idle time). of course... i don't actually flush the same each and every time - but rather the same amount between every shot (if i'm just pulling shots) or between every drink (if i'm building drinks) or between shots or drinks that i've consumed (if i'm drinking full drinks). heh.

i've followed dan's plan as well as some of the posted models, but they're less accurate seeming to me and tend to present some logistical issues for my testing.

i can see how they would make sense given some of the "real world" constraints most people face, but as i'm not making a single espresso (or two) but am pulling a half dozen to a dozen shots in a row or making a half dozen to a dozen drinks in a row (and given that i'm not paying for my beans) and am doing this multiple times a day - the commercial based routine works well for me. it allows me to be fast and consistent and allows me to efficiently generate results.

i'm actually very familiar with the profile of the Hairbender (to say the least) and am probably able to identify variances in brew temp down to around 1F. i'd say i''ve been within 2F on all shots and am usually within 1F with this methodology. i'd be more than willing to measure with a multimeter if people feel that is important.

i don't know if i'd recommend it to most folks - but it works for this situation and for me. of course, it assumes that you take pretty much exactly the same time to build each and every shot, assumes you're quick and consistent doing so and assumes you can adjust flush based on the time you've taken if you're switching between pulling shots and building full drinks.

if i had to guess about the cause of the perceived deficiencies of the shots as compared to those from commercial machines i would tend to not point my finger at brew temp. when the Hairbender is pulled at a temp that is too low you get a noticable citrus tone and lose much of the chocolate. if it's too hot, you get strong pepper spice notes and a harsh tobacco bite. in both cases, the mouthfeel is, indeed, thinner - but oh boy is it ever long lasting!!

my guess for a culprit would be a toss up between the vibe pump and the ramped brew temp. both seem likely to have an effect on the extraction and could, in theory, result in the blurring of flavours and the diminished mouthfeel.

actually, the Mistral is not an HX machine but rather a dual boiler machine

LOL, I have egg all over my face. I keep confusing it with the Mirage. I'm sure I'll make that mistake a few more times before it sinks in

Believe me... you're hardly the first!

I'm starting to settle in with the Mia.

The new two-hole tip makes a huge difference, but also I'm just getting used to the machine - starting to learn its quirks and its habits.

I pulled a whole stack of shots with Terry's Big Truck espresso this morning. Very enjoyable and (actually) better tasting than the shots I pulled of it on his Linea.

I'm able to be very consistent with the shot quality, time and volume now. It's pretty cool. While the machine is very, very different from something like the Mistral, it's actually not that different from a commercial HX machine. And yes, that is a compliment.




As I get used to this machine (and periodically compare it to both the Astoria and the Linea) I'm starting to appreciate some things about it a lot.

First - the deep drip tray. If you're not plumbing your machine in then you really, really need a deep drip tray - and the Mia has it.

Second - the quick start-up time. Instead of the multi-hour start-up of a Linea (never, ever turn it off is the answer) or the 45 minute start-up of the Astoria, with the Mia I can be pulling consistent shots within a half hour.

Third - the large water reservoir. Again, if you're not plumbing it in you need a large reservoir -- and the Mia has it.


Finally, with the new tip the milk is finally there. It's still a bit hard for me to get used to such a low-power wand, but I think I see the point. It's far harder to create BABs with this wand, making it a lot more user-friendly. It's kind of like designing a car that deliberately understeers... you're going to make the car safer for the vast majority of people out there and it's only the serious fanatics and pros who are going to be frustrated by the lack of performance.

hi Chris,
thanks for the review, esp the flushing part. please explain more about your flushing scheme.
cheers

Chris,

I too would like to hear more about your flushing routine on this machine.

Cheers,
Jimmy

what would you like to know?
i've described it (admittedly in two spots) earlier in the thread. what kind of additional detail would you like? i'll gladly provide all else.

malachi wrote:One side note -- I'm not following the "normal protocol" for temp-surfing as defined by most home users. Instead, I'm doing what most pros do with a HX machine. I'm flushing for about 2 seconds when I pull the portafilter and then I'm flushing for a long 6 count immediately before inserting the portafilter and pulling the shot. The Grimac came from EPNW set to a target of 201F. The Hairbender is best at 200F. The protocol I'm following seems to nail the brew temp for the Hairbender.

malachi wrote:that being said, i do base my methodology on what one would do with a commercial E61 based machine. but... i start from a deadpoint by doing a considerable flush to force autofill and heating element then time initially off the element shutting off. from there i go into a 'traditional' commercial flush mode (because, as noted below, i don't have to worry about idle time). of course... i don't actually flush the same each and every time - but rather the same amount between every shot (if i'm just pulling shots) or between every drink (if i'm building drinks) or between shots or drinks that i've consumed (if i'm drinking full drinks). heh.

i've followed dan's plan as well as some of the posted models, but they're less accurate seeming to me and tend to present some logistical issues for my testing.

if i refer to correctly, here're two posts that you're talking about.

now questions
regarding the pro's flushing the HX, how would boiler pressure gauge read when it's idle? how would it read after doing such flush? i don't have thermometer install, as other home users, so the gauge reading would give better idea how it goes.
my machine doesn't have a light to tell me when the heating element or the boiler is refilling. so are there any other signs to tell me?
cheers,

default wrote:
regarding the pro's flushing the HX, how would boiler pressure gauge read when it's idle? how would it read after doing such flush? i don't have thermometer install, as other home users, so the gauge reading would give better idea how it goes.
my machine doesn't have a light to tell me when the heating element or the boiler is refilling. so are there any other signs to tell me?
cheers,

I don't flush off boiler gauge readings and don't know of anyone who does in a commercial setting. The gauges are well-known for their lack of accuracy.
You should be able to hear the boiler filling.
If you don't have a heating element light, you can either try to use Dan's method or the idle time method mentioned by Abe or go with the more humanistic old school commerical method of:
1 - flush until autofill start;
2 - grind, dose, distribute, tamp;
3 - extract (taste just for a baseline and for timing);
4 - grind, dose, distribute, tamp;
5 - extract;
6 - taste.
It will probably show signs of brew temp that is too high. So repeat starting with step 4, but this time flush between 4 and 5 for a count of one. If still to high in temp, repeat and flush for a count of two. Etc.
The nice thing about this will be that you'll learn how to use the machine, identify flavours, etc. In addition, in a commercial environment you'll be able to identify what the flush is when busy as a baseline and from that you can adjust longer for slower times.
Not very scientific - but if you want science you can start with Dan's model or Abe's model (just be aware that these will give you a starting point but that you'll need to adjust from it for most commercial machine and commercial volume).