woodchuck wrote:Also Marshall does your machine have the new graphics? Was there much change from the unit I have?

Not your pro-level photography, Ian, but here it is:

Ah yes.....the smaller font is so much better.

All kidding aside, it looks to be a great machine. The knob is probably a lot faster and more user friendly than the LED method on the Vivaldis. Just looks a bit old fashioned.

How much weight did they save with the carbon fibre....dang...there I go again.

I saw a picture that looked like it had a chrome colored cover. It might have been the Super Mini, but it did look better. I think they should do colors. I can't imagine that cover would be too expensive to produce.

sweaner wrote:I saw a picture that looked like it had a chrome colored cover.

An earlier version had a silvery-gray plastic.

Endo wrote:Ah yes.....the smaller font is so much better.

Yes, it is. I hate garish.

At least they got rid of the "proof of taste" stamped on the front. Is there some reason they don't just put a "Dalla Corte" logo on the front of the drip tray (or the name of his daughter... ).

OK, enough about styling, I've got to get back to designing my new side panels for my Mini Vivaldi. Hmmm, stamped chrome with black gloss trim and nice round LaSpaziale logo in the center, that would look sweet.

Endo wrote:At least they got rid of the "proof of taste" stamped on the front. Is there some reason they don't just put a "Dalla Corte" logo on the front of the drip tray (or the name of his daughter...

It's on the back, facing the "customers" (or, in my case, the wall of my bar).

Don't get me wrong, it's a machine I want to love . . . but it also has to gain aesthetic approval from the other people who live in the house. Well, OK, the kids probably don't get a vote (though my 14 year old would complain mightly if she didn't!), but my wife Lynn sure does!

The Edsel was a really good car; it just looks like $#!+ . . . Ford ask people what they wanted in a car, and the result was an Edsel. Ford learned their lesson, and asked people what their neighbors wanted in a car, and the result was the Mustang!

woodchuck wrote: Anyone have a 54mm bottomless pf they want to lend me

The vibe pump is noisy. I have learned to love the rotary so this is a small con for me. Taste wise I don't think there is a whole lot of difference between vibes or rotaries. But it is noisier. Perhaps some more damping would help.

Cheers

Ian

I've got one you can borrow. PM me the shipping information.

I used the Mini for several weeks and now have the Super Mini. I really do like its whisper silent rotary.

Nice looking machine inside and out.
The size is the most attractive part about it for me.
...guess I'm the only one who likes the looks
Anyways, can't wait to read more about this little wonder.

Hopefully, a long and fruitful thread. Request to Jim and those who actually have some experience with the machine: Please add triple baskets to your trials. I just received my thinner dispersion disk and a triple; clearly, some people, somewhere, think that using one, the other, or both is a good idea. Grams-in-basket is a helpful metric, but just as useful might be the degree of resistance when locking the pf----none to a tight squeeze.

My experience with triples (E61) was inconclusive, but I never bothered to work with that dose until I got it right.

Once I found that the machine actively resisted overdosing (you can't lock the portafilter) I settled in with 14 to 15 gram dosing and found that I could get very good shots. The Dalla Corte sort of forces you to follow Ken Fox's prescription for dosing.

hperry wrote:Once I found that the machine actively resisted overdosing (you can't lock the portafilter) I settled in with 14 to 15 gram dosing and found that I could get very good shots. The Dalla Corte sort of forces you to follow Ken Fox's prescription for dosing.

Interesting. I grind by dose. Mid-17g for doubles then level by finger to close to 16 or just under and tamp. But not close to 14. This allows me to lock (obviously) but still feel some pressure. I like this "full" (but not over-- ?) dose because I can grind a shade courser. Our different estimates on dose-by-weight might be accounted for by variations in basket size or . . .? I'd like to hear from others on this weight for doubles.

A few more shots with the triple basket (original "thicker" dispersion disk) prompts this speculation: Several have observed that the DC wants a finer grind than they are used to on other machines. In my experience, finer grinds can produce very good shots, but the sweet spot "band" is narrower. Possibly a tight dose, even a triple, reduces the chance of needing an overly-fine grind to hit one's time-to-shot volume target. All the more reason to await reports of repeated and controlled tests.

Martin wrote:Interesting. I grind by dose. Mid-17g for doubles then level by finger to close to 16 or just under and tamp. But not close to 14. This allows me to lock (obviously) but still feel some pressure. I like this "full" (but not over-- ?) dose because I can grind a shade courser. Our different estimates on dose-by-weight might be accounted for by variations in basket size or . . .? I'd like to hear from others on this weight for doubles.

There is a difference in basket size (double vs triple). I have tried it both ways and had much the same experience as you. The lower dose requires a finer grind, indeed a finer grind than I have used on some other machines. Dosed the way you are doing it I get an indent from the dispersion screen screw, which suggests to me that the coffee is too close to it. I do think there is a narrower band where the flavor is "right" but currently I'm trying to sort out how much of that is grind, how much temperature, and how much the barista.

Hal,
I actually was referring to differences among double baskets. All DC baskets shipped might be identical, but that was not the case with my previous machines. In particular, I have 3 La Spaziale baskets that differ by as much as one gram up to the indent.

On the DC some slight indent from the dispersion screw head seems "normal." (Others, please check in on this.) I assume that occurs (mostly) after the puck expands just a bit. Even some screen pattern on the puck (if you've been able to lock in) doesn't ruin a shot unless it's choked.

Anyway, HB "Buyer's Guides" (for whatever machine under review) are also valuable "User's Guides" ---whether or not the reader owns or wants that particular machine. As mentioned in my earlier post, I'm hoping that the DC Guide will add some more empirical insights to the questions users raise.

Endo wrote:At least they got rid of the "proof of taste" stamped on the front. Is there some reason they don't just put a "Dalla Corte" logo on the front of the drip tray (or the name of his daughter... ).

I would prefer the name of a daughter or son, or even the name of a childhood sled, to that oxymoron.

Gemma di Rosa

Boy, you would think holidays would open up some machine time. Not so, too much visiting and definitely too much eating Anyways, had some machine time today so pulled some shots with a couple of different dosings. The pictures below are for 16gr and 14gr respectively. Each series has a shot just after leveling, tamping, locked in and finally after the shot. I'm sure different coffee densities will move this around a bit but for me 16gr is easy to get to by simply leveling the basket after dosing. The 14gr basket required a little more finesse.

The 16gr basket is at the upper limit of the DC. The screen bolt leaves a heavy impression and the coffee is up against the screen when locked in. The 14gr dose still touches the bolt head but just barely. You have to tighten up the 14gr dose to get a similar shot time to the 16gr dose. Both pulls ended up pretty much at screen level when finished. I think the 16gr dose pretty much was screen limited were as the 14gr dose just touched the screen when the puck was saturated.

Interesting but what about the taste? Well frankly I would have to say the I preferred the 16gr dose. I found that I could get a more viscous (read syrupy) shot with the higher dose that with the 14gr dose even when I tightened it up. Not a big difference in taste per se but just better mouth feel.
Hal was kind enough to ship me off his blind pf so when it arrives I'll have a closer look at the shot differences across various weights.

Cheers

Ian

16gr


14gr

Well a good day was had by all. I had Dan and Al over yesterday to bang away at the Dalla Corte. Al Vista was the Latte Art winner and recipient of a brand new Dalla Corte Mini from the Whole Latte Love Latte Art Challenge last year:



And yes he can pour some decent drinks. We were lucky enough to have gotten a wonderfully aged batch of Aficionado from Counter Culture Coffee at our regular Friday get together at CCC.

We had spent the day before doing blinds on shots ground on a Mazzer Robur and a Compak K10 - you can see read about the results on Dan's post - Compak K10 vs Mazzer Robur. Needless to say we had a good idea of how the Aficionado was pouring - actually great with a ton of body some nutty notes and wonderfully long finish. Dan was doing the pulling so maybe that had something to do with it

Anyways CCC let us have another batch for our testing with the Dalla Corte. We had trouble initially getting the more interesting flavors from the coffee. We went down to 14gr of coffee but still were missing something. Finally we decided to lower the pressure - yes sir jackpot! The DC comes without a brew pressure gauge so you are flying a bit blind on this one. Once we cranked the pressure down the nuttiness and finish came back. You definitely can't up dose this machine much as even at 14gr there is a small impression on the puck from the diffusion block bolt.

I ran out today and built a little gauge just to see where we were. Home Depot is your friend!
Here is a quick snap of setup:



Changing the pressure is real easy. Just a small counter clockwise turn on the OPV valve to lower the pressure and Bob's your uncle (about a 1/4 turn per bar).



My guess is we were sitting at about 10.5 bar before we cranked it down. Looking good now.



More to come on optimal dosing. Once again thanks to Counter Culture for the coffee. It was much enjoyed!

Cheers

Ian

The pressure adjustment makes sense. James Warren said he adjusted my machine to 9.5 bar before shipping it out. I don't know for sure if this is being done on all U.S. machines now, but I thought it was (as well as calibrating the temperature on a Scace).

Many thanks to hperry for loaning me his bottomless portafilter. I know taste is the final criteria but it sure helps me to see whats going on under the hood. I ran a few shots through the DC today - finishing off the Aficionado from the weekend. I ran shots from 14g to 16gr and tried to keep run time to around 25 sec before blonding started or the cone started to collapse. The best shot for me today turned out to be right in the middle 15gr. A bit more body than the 14gr and a little brighter than the 16gr. Interestingly enough I still have to crank the grind down much tighter on the DC than the VII - almost two notches on the Robur - even though the pressures are about the same now. I had some good shots, only one 16gr fell apart on me. Testimony to the Robur's consistency. Will do some more testing as the week unfolds.

Cheers

Ian

15gr 25 seconds