Hi

I've been struggling with my new setup. Right now, I'm at the point where I can get a balanced shot (i.e. neither sour nor bitter) on demand. I'm doing WDT, dosing by weight, checking for a level, even tamp.

So what's wrong? Mouthfeel and crema, and potentially extraction. At a cafe, I get a nice heavy mouthfeel. At home, with the same beans, the crema dissipates pretty quickly (less than a minute), and the mouthfeel is somewhat watery. In addition, I expected a more intense set of flavors (and have tasted them on occasion at a cafe before).

Here is a typical extraction:

This one was 19 seconds from start to stop, including preinfusion. The beans were Andytown's Short Strand, roasted 4 days ago. I dosed 15g into the standard double basket, and stopped the extraction at 28g. As you can see, the extraction was a little fast. However, I expected a longer cone, from watching many of the videos in the "show us your routine" thread.

I could probably go a notch or two finer on my Vario, to get the extraction up to 25-30 seconds. Other than that, I'm out of ideas.

Oh and how'd it taste? Balanced most of the shot. A little bitter aftertaste lingered. A little watery to be sure.

If you hadn't said they were roasted 4 days ago, I would have guessed stale beans !?

Your pour starts perfectly, with all areas of the basket extracting at the same time. Maybe it's just the way the beans pull? If it tastes good, I wouldn't worry about a great looking cone. Of course grind a bit finer.

mad1 wrote:I could probably go a notch or two finer on my Vario, to get the extraction up to 25-30 seconds. Other than that, I'm out of ideas.

I would definitely try that first. Most good cafes are probably targeting a 25-30 second extraction, so if you're trying to replicate what they're doing, that's a good place to start. Also, you can probably just ask them how they're pulling their shots. I'm not sure how common weighing shots is these days, but a few cafes near me are doing it (for straight shots only I think) and any of the baristas can rattle off the "grams in, grams out" numbers for whatever coffee they're pulling.

Also, give those beans a rest.

I have been lurking around for a few years, and 'fresh beans' has to be one of the most widely used terms, for good reason. However, i think for espresso, it is a bit of a moving target, as espresso needs some rest before it will pull ideally. the amount of rest depends on the coffee, roast level, and probably some other factors.

when i first started i would follow the 'fresh beans' advice, and sometimes would have trouble getting consistent pours. i had seen mention of proper resting period before, but since it is variable, there is not really a definitive answer. I bought some coffee at a roasters cafe here, and, like you, i was comparing my shots with what they serve, and could not achieve even close to the shot they were serving. on a repeat visit, i was talking with the manager, and she told me that their main roast, they generally don't serve it until about 7 days, and some of their S.O coffees even longer. she gave me half a bag of beans right out of the hopper, and that immediately improved my shots, and following their exact grams in/grams out brought me closer yet, close enough that i deemed the difference to be barista skill and quality/stability of grinder/machine.

after that, i generally start using beans at about 7 days post roast, and around here it takes a few days to finish off the bag. some roasts seem to do even better closer to 10 days post roast, and once the beans tend to get a few weeks old, that is when i start to notice some nuances that just aren't there anymore, however i find that shot consistency is still good, usually more consistent then beans roasted within a few days. keep in mind if i am using beans 2 weeks or more old, that they have been sealed in their bag for the whole time, an open bag only lasts a few days here. i have also found that i am out of beans and i end up using beans only a few days post roast, that putting some in my hopper the night before or leaving the bag open seems to help a bit, maybe it helps the beans off gas a little more.

all of my results are from my personal experience, i have learned over the years to research and take in as much information as possible from as many sources as possible, consider that info, but then come to your own conclusions.

Best of luck!

They may also be dosing higher than 15g. Try 16-18g and see what happens? It looks good enough that there's not major problems you have to deal with. Just grind/dose to your tastes. As you mention, you can keep 15g and grind finer, but I would first try upping the dose.

I 2nd the vote on a tick or two finer on the grind.

Also, I have found that, for me at least, I really prefer the triple basket and about 19g.. Still shooting for a 25-30 second extraction.

It can be done with the double, but once I moved to ~19g, I never went back to my 14-16 basket.

Looks real good.. keep in mind, if you are close, you can tamp just a touch harder and see if that brings up your time as well.

v

Sorry for the late reply, I've been traveling. Thanks for all the really helpful responses.

I switched to Stumptown's Hairbender. I tried a finer grind, 18g dose, 24-25g out. Much much better crema and mouthfeel. off topic: Not a huge fan of the taste (I think I like more fruity espresso at this point in life)